David Who?

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In the month of June:

  • .441 batting (second)
  • .547 on-base (first)
  • 1.085 slugging (first)
  • 1.632 OPS (first)
  • 9 HR (first)
  • 21 RBI (first)
  • 27 hits (fifth)
  • 7 doubles (fourth)
  • 2 triples (first)
  • 18 extra-base hits (first)
  • 14 walks (third)
  • 22 runs (first)

Most amazing: 18 of 27 hits for extra bases.

33 comments… add one
  • Just imagine if they had dumped him like many SF’s wanted last year???

    krueg June 19, 2008, 11:21 am
  • Fans are so fickle. Dustin Pedroia would have been in the minors for most of last year, too, if many had had their way.
    I’m proud to say I defended both players when they struggled. :-)

    Paul SF June 19, 2008, 11:36 am
  • I would just like to add the fact that I said everything was going to be fine with David out and JD in his spot.
    And SF laughed at me for calling him J.Dizzle and the fact that I had the T-Shirt.

    Brad June 19, 2008, 11:38 am
  • Never any doubt in my mind!*
    *lies, all lies

    LocklandSF June 19, 2008, 11:55 am
  • It’s all about the “J-Dizzle” nickname, Brad, not the player. I have been, with Paul, one of the more consistent JD supporters here.
    Certainly we can do better than “J-Dizzle”, right?
    “Silent Papi”? Not exactly a winner, either. Let’s all work on it.

    SF June 19, 2008, 12:09 pm
  • I’m a big booster of J-Dizzle. Sorry, SF. It just appeals to me.

    Paul SF June 19, 2008, 12:11 pm
  • Over the last 7:
    Player A: .524/.630/1.772
    Player B: .370/.469/1.469
    Hint: Player A is not JD Drew.
    [Aside: sure is nice to have our MVP back in the lineup! Look out above!]

    YF June 19, 2008, 12:16 pm
  • Player C (last 30 days): .431/.472/1.024
    The ’07 reports of the early demise of our washed up lead-off man seem to have been greatly exagerated.

    IronHorse (yf) June 19, 2008, 12:34 pm
  • Just, um, for the record, A-Rod has never had a month where he slugged over 1.000 or put up an OPS over 1.600. Not that Drew will (he’s still got 10 games left), but A-Rod outhitting Drew over seven games just isn’t that noteworthy.
    This, however, seems pretty remarkable:
    Drew, June 2008): 17 games, .441/.547/1.085
    Rodriguez, April 2007): 17 games, .400/.457/1.057
    I believe that was A-Rod’s best 17-game stretch with the Yankees.

    Paul SF June 19, 2008, 12:36 pm
  • Edes had a nice piece in the Globe, as well, about how Drew is hitting better than Yaz ever did in ’67, or Ortiz or Manny ever did, or Mo Vaughn in his heyday, based on their monthly splits. The problem is that Drew does have 10 games left in the month, and a lot can happen to kill your averages in just 10 games…

    Paul SF June 19, 2008, 12:47 pm
  • “A-Rod has never had a month where he slugged over 1.000 or put up an OPS over 1.600.”
    That’s a weird way of framing this discussion. Bottom line, Alex outhitting JD over 7 games “just isn’t that noteworthy” because it’s basically what happens every 7 days.

    YF June 19, 2008, 12:51 pm
  • “A-Rod has never had a month where he slugged over 1.000 or put up an OPS over 1.600.”
    I didnt look it up but I can basically assure you that JD Drew has never come close to these numbers for a month either. I also doubt that many players have. Id actually be shocked if he stays over these thresholds for the end of the month. Im sure if we looked we could find a 20 game stretch for A-Rod with similar numbers.

    Sam-YF June 19, 2008, 12:59 pm
  • sweet, YF himself with a SMOOVE thread hijack! Well played!

    SF June 19, 2008, 1:11 pm
  • We’re talking about superhot players in the rivalry. Not that much of a digression!

    YF June 19, 2008, 1:13 pm
  • I, for one, am still skeptical. While Drew’s been insanely hot, and has helped the team thrive in the absence of the Large Father, I’d like to see another month or so of production before I’m ready to call him “rejuvenated.”
    He’s a noticably better 1st-half hitter (2/3rds of his career homers have been before the AS break), and June has historically been his best month (career .301/.408/.581).
    What’s more promising for me as a Sox fan (looking long-term) is the .308/.410/.524 line with 19 HRs and 78 RBIs that he’s put up over the last 12 months (142 games). That’s still not $14 million production, but it’s getting closer to the numbers he put up in his breakout season in Atlanta in ’04.

    Columbus-SF June 19, 2008, 1:16 pm
  • > A-Rod has never had a month where he slugged over 1.000 or put up an OPS over 1.600
    Obviously looking at monthly splits is a completely arbitrary framing and therefore doesn’t mean much except as a curiosity, but I wonder how many modern-era players ever have had that kind of split? I scanned a couple of the big names. The only one I could find who did it was Bonds, and he did it a few times. McGwire? Nope. Sammy? Never. Nor Mantle. Thomas came close once in 1994. If Drew sustains, it will be an interesting feat.

    attackgerbil June 19, 2008, 1:23 pm
  • Obviously looking at monthly splits is a completely arbitrary framing and therefore doesn’t mean much except as a curiosity,
    No disagreement there. I’m still struggling with the relevance of even pointing out the last seven days — equally arbitrary, if not more so because at least a month is a timeframe commonly accepted in the calendar.
    A-Rod outhitting Drew isn’t noteworthy because it happens all the time, as YF says. So why note it? Drew having potentially one of the best offensive months in the history of the game is, on the other hand, actually noteworthy.

    Paul SF June 19, 2008, 2:39 pm
  • I’d like to see another month or so of production before I’m ready to call him “rejuvenated.”
    You note his line over the last 12 months, so I’m not sure what else Drew can do if a full year of production isn’t good enough.
    That’s still not $14 million production
    Well, technically, it is. Because that’s how much the Sox are paying for it. But taking your point, that it shouldn’t be, I wholeheartedly disagree. A player who hits .308/.408/.581 for his career is going in the Hall of Fame, and a Hall of Fame player is easily worth $14 million in today’s market. For example, is a player that puts up a career line of .312/.408/.591 worth $14 million. I hope so. That’s Manny Ramirez, currently being paid $20 million by the Sox.

    Paul SF June 19, 2008, 2:47 pm
  • remember when a-rod had that big hit in the playoffs to catapult the yankees to that dramatic comeback…..i don’t either.
    it’s been a beauty couple o’ weeks watching drew. nothing beats a sweet swinging lefty. don’t forget some of the defensive gems he’s turned in as well during that stretch.

    sf rod June 19, 2008, 3:16 pm
  • Fair enough, Paul. And I’ll concede that “technically” a thing’s value is what someone is willing to pay for it, therefore J.D. Drew’s “value” is $14 mil, since that’s what the Sox are giving him. (But would you then likewise argue that Lugo is “worth” his current salary?)
    My statement that his production over the past twelve months is not worth $14 mil was more a reference to the 19 HRs and 78 RBIs, but I understand that those stats are also a function of lineup position, production of other hitters, etc.
    So, to address your two larger points:
    (1) What else could Drew do?
    Well, he could manage to stay healthy enough to play in 130 or more games – which would be the first time in his career he’s managed to do that for three consecutive seasons. He could hit more than 25 HRs (would be only the 3rd time he’s done that) or knock in more than 90 runs (again, for only the third time). He could hit better than .300 (again, would be his third time). Or more than 30 doubles (yep, third time for that, too). Yes, some of these selections I’ve made are arbitrary (as they almost always are in this type of debate), but they go to a larger point – he could stay healthy and productive for a full season. Which he just hasn’t done often enough in his career. Which is why I was squeamish about the Sox signing him for that much cash. And that rolls into point number two…
    (2) Yep, you’re right, .312/.408/.591 over a career (i.e., Manny) is going to the HOF. And he’s probably “worth” every penny the Sox pay him. And if Drew’s career line mirrored Manny’s I’d be the first to say “pay the man.” But the numbers I cited (.308/.408/.581) were his production over the last twelve months. Drew’s career line (.287/.392/.506) is a bit more pedestrian. My point was that I can’t fully embrace Drew until he keeps it up a little longer. Over a season Phil Nevin once went .306/.388/.588 (2001), Ray Lankford pulled out a .295/.411/.585 (1997), Chris Hoiles had a .310/.416/.585 (1993). Again, arbitrary, but just examples.
    Once Drew puts up a career line of .308/.408/.581, I’ll join you in hailing him. And I hope I get a chance to. But not just yet.

    Columbus-SF June 19, 2008, 3:39 pm
  • remember when a-rod had that big hit in the playoffs to catapult the yankees to that dramatic comeback…..i don’t either.
    Actually A-Rod did hit a big HR in the last game of the ALDS last year. It was the rest of his teammates that came up short. Talk about an overplayed meme….

    Sam-YF June 19, 2008, 3:49 pm
  • “Well, he could manage to stay healthy enough to play in 130 or more games”
    Exactly.

    A YF June 19, 2008, 4:08 pm
  • Well, he could manage to stay healthy enough to play in 130 or more games
    Which he’s now done two years in a row, as you acknowledge. Should he develop superpowers that ward off baseballs from hitting him in areas where broken bones are all too common? The injury knock on Drew developed in St. Louis, but once he underwent knee surgery in 2003, he put up the 130+ games you seek three of the next four years. It’s hard to blame him for getting hit in the wrist with a baseball in 2005.
    knock in more than 90 runs
    RBI are far more a function of batting order and lineup strength than individual skill.
    He could hit better than .300
    So his 2000 season wasn’t that great because he hit .295? How about 2003 (.289)? 2005 (.286)? Let’s phrase the arbitrary dividing line this way: Seasons J.D. Drew has hit at least .285 (roughly 15 points above average): Five. Seasons Drew has reached base at least 39 percent of the time (considered excellent): five.
    As you say, this all is arbitrary. But you look at Drew’s career, and frankly, it’s a fantastic career. It’s injury-plagued, yes, but Drew hasn’t had a chronic-type injury in five years. His worst season by far — the only one where he was less than 25 percent above league average — was when his son was critically ill in the hospital for most of the year.
    Drew’s career line (.287/.392/.506) is a bit more pedestrian.
    Of course it is. But it’s also 30 percent above average. Thirty percent. The man has a career 130 career OPS+, and he continues to have to prove to people that he actually is a good hitter. He is 22nd among all active players in career OPS+ — ahead of Derek Jeter ($21.6 million) and slightly behind Bobby Abreu ($15 million). And unlike Jeter and Abreu, Drew provides plus defense. He’s also younger.
    A look at others with similar career OPS+ reveal similar salaries: Magglio Ordonez ($13.2 million), Hideki Matsui ($13 million), Scott Rolen ($12.3 million), Jorge Posada ($12 million). And Drew is younger than all those, as well.
    Over a season Phil Nevin once went .306/.388/.588 (2001), Ray Lankford pulled out a .295/.411/.585 (1997), Chris Hoiles had a .310/.416/.585 (1993).
    Nevin’s career OPS+ was 114. Lankford’s was 122. Hoiles’ was 119. They also were all good hitters, but not as good as Drew (130). So I guess I don’t see the point.
    We’re both Sox fans, and we both are rooting for Drew, so it’s not a big difference. I just think Drew has received a lot of flack unnecessarily from Red Sox fans and is finally receiving a lot of due he should have been getting for much of his career.

    Paul SF June 19, 2008, 4:14 pm
  • the only one where he was less than 25 percent above league average
    Should correct this to 20 percent above league average, and I missed his mediocre 2002 season, which looks to be injury-related. That time in St. Louis killed his numbers and his reputation. He’s recovered the former, obviously not the latter.

    Paul SF June 19, 2008, 4:16 pm
  • the meme continues, while you remember the BIG hr in the loss many still remember game 2 of that ALDS series. with the yanks tied at 1 in the 9th a-rod goes down swinging with abreu at second to end the inning. it was his third consecutive strike out of the game. this was probably the yankees best chance at getting into that series. if you say he hit a homer in that last game of the series, i guess i have to believe you. i’m sure it was a big deal. i know for certain what drew did playoffs.

    sf rod June 19, 2008, 4:37 pm
  • I’m glad you brought it back home with that final point. We both want Drew to be great. I’m just not ready to call it a “fantastic” career yet. And I’m certainly not ready to “forget” about Papi – that was the point of the Nevin, Lankford, and Hoiles comparison. None of them would make you say “David Who?” (Yes, I recognize the title of the post was hyperbole, used for effect, but still…)
    And I’ll be the first to admit I’m not always rational when it comes to the Sox or particular players. I’m a Trot Nixon fan – and would have searched just as hard to find the points in favor of Trot as I do to find those against Drew. So is some of the grief I give Drew unnecessary? Yep, probably is. Again, not rational or logical. But when it comes to fandom, there it is. That’s why I get paid to do something other than evaluate baseball talent. I wouldn’t be nearly objective enough.
    But as for Drew, he’s had an amazing month of June so far. Here’s to an amazing July, and August, and beyond.

    Columbus-SF June 19, 2008, 4:41 pm
  • But as for Drew, he’s had an amazing month of June so far. Here’s to an amazing July, and August, and beyond.
    Amen.

    Paul SF June 19, 2008, 4:47 pm
  • > the meme continues
    Nah. Fausto Carmona was brilliant that game. Handing ARod the blame for the Yankees dumping out on that series is just ridiculous. Jeter, Posada, Melky, Godzilla… all had far worse series, and even then it was that Wang put them in too-deep holes in his two starts.

    attackgerbil June 19, 2008, 5:02 pm
  • “…seven days — equally arbitrary, if not more so because at least a month is a timeframe commonly accepted in the calendar.”
    I could swear there was something about 7 days that is also commonly accepted in most calendars – I think it even has a name. Can anyone help me out?
    (OK, off topic I know, but that was begging for s snide response – sorry Paul…)

    IronHorse (yf) June 19, 2008, 5:25 pm
  • It’s fine, IH. I just didn’t know weeks started on Thursdays…

    Paul SF June 19, 2008, 5:36 pm
  • As Fletch would say, “They do in Haiti”.

    IronHorse (yf) June 19, 2008, 5:49 pm
  • How long has it been since last Thursday anyway?? :o)

    IronHorse (yf) June 19, 2008, 5:50 pm
  • > I just didn’t know weeks started on Thursdays…
    This makes me chuckle, for a couple reasons. One is for those of us that have a seven-day work week and/or a kid, I have to quip, “What are these ‘weeks’ of which you speak?”
    -and-
    There’s the flip side, embodied by one of my favorite Les Claypool lines: “Funny thing about weekends. When you’re unemployed. They don’t quite mean so much, except you get to hang out with all your working friends.”
    Primus. ROCK.

    attackgerbil June 19, 2008, 6:42 pm

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