Going Out Strong

Buster Olney reports that Yankee Stadium, in its final season of 2008, will be host to MLB’s All-Star Game for the third time, and the first since 1977 (and I need not remind you who claimed the October prize that season). We’ll take that as a good omen. One question: Will Philip Hughes be starting?

66 comments… add one

  • …i assume you mean will hughes be starting the all star game, yf, so i’ll go out on a limb now and say “no”…in order to get enough attention to start the game, hughes will have had to make the trip north with the yankees and actually be a significant contributor from the opening bell…high hopes i think…

    dc January 17, 2007, 1:40 pm
  • Will Philip Hughes be starting?
    ____________________
    We hope so. Regular season that is. If he is pitching, that means that one or more of the pitching slots has been vacated for whatever reason, which means that NY was forced to start a rookie coming down the stretch. Good times, indeed.

    Brad January 17, 2007, 2:05 pm
  • …sure would be good times to see the guy live up to the hype by being good enough to start the all star game, steal rookie of the year from dm, and start [win] some meaningful post season games……every great pitcher was a rookie once upon a time [see papelbon]…

    dc January 17, 2007, 2:16 pm
  • hughes won’t be coming north when they break camp. ca$hman has already declared it so the other day. getting that out there now means that the kid can just throw (next month… oh thank god, spring training is a month away) without additional pressure.
    this is an excerpt from yesterday’s verducci article at SI.com:
    “Joe Torre called up after the Anaheim series [in late August] when we were stretched for pitchers and said, “What about bringing up Hughes?”’ Cashman said. “On the next homestand, Gator [pitching coach Ron Guidry] asked me about bringing up Hughes to help out the staff. I joked with him and said, ‘Nope. I’m saving him for the next pitching coach.”‘
    hell yes.
    i can’t wait to see the kid play. if he can do 3/4 of what people say he’s capable of, it’ll be a special thing to see.
    has anyone heard anthing on lester? i assume he’ll try to be ready when things start up. (have i mentioned that it is only a month away?) i was just curious.

    Yankee Fan In Boston January 17, 2007, 2:45 pm
  • Interesting discussion at SoSH

    here

    comparing Beckett and Hughes at similar points in their minor league careers – starts at comment #38 or so.

    SF January 17, 2007, 2:46 pm
  • I assume YF meant in 2008, not 2007 (as in steal DM’s RoY award that he does not yet have, and pitch enough this season, which I doubt will happen).

    QuoSF January 17, 2007, 2:54 pm
  • You’re all forgetting that we’re talking about the 2008 game. Not 2007. So Hughes starting is a realistic possibility. Not as realistic as Matsuzaka or Papelbon starting the ’08 All-Star Game (since we’re projecting starters’ performances essentially site unseen TWO YEARS from now). But still.

    Paul SF January 17, 2007, 2:55 pm
  • comparing Beckett and Hughes….
    wait – hughes can throw 98mph and has one of the best, and most underused, breakers in the game? If he comes with Beckett’s fiery on field attitude in combination with his pure and unquestioned stuff, then Yankee fans really have something to cheer about here.

    Brad January 17, 2007, 3:03 pm
  • It also points to the difficulty in projecting minor leaguers out as big league starters; Beckett came touted as a golden child (Hughes is being touted as even more golden, platinum perhaps!?), and we’re still waiting for all of Beckett’s potential to be fulfilled.

    SF January 17, 2007, 3:08 pm
  • Amen to that SF…Tick Tick Tick…JK

    Triskaidekaphobia January 17, 2007, 3:15 pm
  • I think Hughes need a season with 5 ERA to fairly compare to Beckett.

    Lar January 17, 2007, 3:32 pm
  • I don’t see how DoorMat can win ROY if several writers didn’t believe Matsui was a rookie his first year and lost to Berrora. Of course he is a Red Sock so I’m sure he’ll win it unanimously.

    YF in Mich January 17, 2007, 3:32 pm
  • Beckett won a ring pitching a gem. Maybe he feels he has little left to prove.

    Seth January 17, 2007, 3:40 pm
  • Ah yes, the Great Anti-Yankee Bias. It really cost A-Rod that MVP awa … oh wait. Well, it really hurt the Yanks when it came time for fans to vote for the ’06 All-Star Ga… no, hold on, wait a second. I know, they all hate Jeter, as evidenced by his Gold Gloves and the constant fawning over him on every nationally broadcast gam… well, crap.

    Paul SF January 17, 2007, 3:41 pm
  • “wait – hughes can throw 98mph and has one of the best, and most underused, breakers in the game? If he comes with Beckett’s fiery on field attitude in combination with his pure and unquestioned stuff, then Yankee fans really have something to cheer about here.”
    Brad, while Hughes cannot throw 98 like Beckett, he can throw 95-96 with much better control and command, and unlike Beckett, he can actually throw his curveball for strikes. Hughes will also most likely make the majors younger than Beckett did. It’s too early to tell, but there is a good chance that Hughes first 5 seasons in the MLB will be better than Beckett’s.

    Eric January 17, 2007, 3:45 pm
  • I’ve made comments about this before, but voting prejudices or not, stop beating the Matsui 2003 RoY dead horse. Berroa deserved the RoY whether he got it due to so-called voting prejudices or not.

    QuoSF January 17, 2007, 3:46 pm
  • He deserved it over Matsui that year? How’s that again?

    meals January 17, 2007, 3:51 pm
  • The media has nothing to do w/ Gold gloves or All-Star game voting…but I’m sure you knew that already.
    It’s Tim McCarver and Joe Morgan more than anyone. And the two of them don’t equal one P. Gammons.

    YF in Mich January 17, 2007, 3:54 pm
  • Wow. At the risk of repeating myself to an extreme degree:
    “Here’s the B-R award page for 2003: http://tinyurl.com/373owb
    Nearly identical BA, OPS, one more HR for Angel in less ABs, 19 more SB. Angel was poor then on D, though he did show above-average range. You can make the argument that Matsui was the stronger defender, and I’d have a hard time trying to tell you you were wrong. However, Matsui was playing the consensus next-to-least difficult defensive position, and Angel was playing the first or second most difficult. With his SBs, Angel was also the more complete threat offensively last season.”
    Actually, that is completely repeating myself. Either way, The Matsui vs. Berroa RoY race is a poor example for YFs to use to try to show a bias against Yankee players.

    QuoSF January 17, 2007, 3:58 pm
  • but there is a good chance that Hughes first 5 seasons in the MLB will be better than Beckett’s.
    Based on what? Your own hopes and opinions?
    Beckett was the next Nolan, Pedro and Roger all wrapped into one, but for some reason, we’re still waiting. You saying it’s so doesn’t make it so. Show me something that says the kid is a better all around prospect than Beckett.
    Jesus, do I hope this kid turns into the next Ryan Leaf. If it weren’t for the unbelievable hype and unfounded promise surrounding him, I would probably want him to do well, but I’m just so tired of hearing him touted as the savior of the baseball world. It’s crazy. It’s gotten to the point that YF’s are proclaiming how good his first five years will be! He’s not even touched AAA ball yet, but some of you are sure he’ll be better than a former WS MVP over the first five years. Calm down, guy.

    Brad January 17, 2007, 4:03 pm
  • Quo – though no one uses sabr for awards, the OPS+ tells a different story – 96 vs 111. (There’s also a bunch of other park adjusted values to compare with) Also, you “forgot” about RBIs – that’s a 30 RBI difference. That should at least cancel out the SB’s (as they obviously have different roles on their teams).
    I didn’t say Angel doesn’t deserved it, but as a “rookie”, Matsui deserves not to be left off..

    Lar January 17, 2007, 4:11 pm
  • David Eckstein is a former WS MVP. Let’s not trump up that award too much.
    Brad, why must you tempt me with your Beckett talk?! I’m biting my tongue. Must leave now.

    Nick-YF January 17, 2007, 4:13 pm
  • Scott Brosius was a WS MVP.. =P
    http://baseballanalysts.com/archives/2005/11/red_soxmarlins.php
    has a good read on Beckett (pre-2006). To put things in prospective, since pitching for NL East, in Dolphin Stadium helps your stats a little bit. But at least we can agree on “how” to compare him to Hughes later on!

    Lar January 17, 2007, 4:17 pm
  • Beckett has not been an ace, but I hear a lot of people acting like he’s somehow had a crappy first five seasons. When he’s been healthy, he’s been a fantastic pitcher, and he has a World Series MVP under his belt. He wasn’t everything he was promised to be, but as someone in the SOSH thread said, no one expects the next Pedro — because those kinds of pitchers are once in a lifetime. Even Pedro wasn’t supposed to be the next Pedro.

    Paul SF January 17, 2007, 4:18 pm
  • Bring it, Nick. When I first read the troller’s comments at the link posted above, my first thought it that it was you!
    Projecting this kid better than Beckett’s first five years is a ‘bit much. I’d make this argument if he said any ML pitcher who’s currently on a roster on a ML team. The comparisons do not match in any way shape or form.

    Brad January 17, 2007, 4:19 pm
  • Matsui had 10 first place votes and lost by two points to Berroa. It’s not like Matsui was stricken from the balloting, like some here have made it sound.

    Paul SF January 17, 2007, 4:21 pm
  • No, you are wrong Nick. David Eckstein is the current World Series MVP. For at least a year, right?
    Not to sound like a broken record, but Beckett was one of the great pitching prospects of the last 15 years. Ask any rotisserie baseball player from 2001-2002 how highly regarded he was as a junior. Hughes has the same hype, maybe more. And Beckett has shown that there’s a big leap from all-world prospect to top-of-the-rotation pitcher in the AL East.
    Beckett’s career arc here:
    http://www.thebaseballcube.com/players/B/josh-beckett.shtml

    SF January 17, 2007, 4:22 pm
  • I predict Philip Hughes will have a better first five seasons than Kyle Snyder.

    Paul SF January 17, 2007, 4:22 pm
  • And one has to think that Beckett’s time in the NL East only helped his progression. It’s almost like he was allowed to participate in a AAAA division before he came to the AL East. Just being thrown into the fire is absolutely harder than the way Beckett went about it. Now, you can make that as a strike against Beckett for not having the success his first year, but I don’t know anyone who doesn’t think he’ll be better this year.
    The AL East is an animal best wrestled by experience, and if Yankee fans are smart, they’ll want Hughes to have nothing to do with it this year – especially if it’s important.
    HA.
    A guy in my lab just said that he’d rather W have another four years at it than to see this kid do well at any point.
    Now that’s funny.

    Brad January 17, 2007, 4:27 pm
  • Paul – two writers refused to vote for Matsui based purely on the fact that he “was not a rookie”. Not speculations on our part:
    Jim Souhan:
    “Had I considered Matsui a rookie, I’m not sure where I would have placed him on the ballot. Maybe second. Maybe third. Maybe not.”
    Ballou:
    “while he (Matsui) is technically a rookie by the rules of Major League Baseball, he is not a rookie in the spirit of the award.”

    Lar January 17, 2007, 4:30 pm
  • Sabermetrics, you say?
    WARP1, 2003
    Berroa: 5.9
    Matsui: 3.2
    FRAR, 2003 (Adjusted for All-time)
    Berroa: 42 (according to Prospectus, 33 is average for a SS)
    Matsui: 1 (according to Prospectus, 14 is average for a LF)
    WARP3, 2003
    Berroa: 7.8
    Matsui: 4.2
    It’s simply not an outrage that Berroa won the RoY in 2003. I can’t see how YFs can be indignant about this, anymore than us SFs can be indignant over the MVP race in 2005. Similar numbers, and A-Rod did play D (and wasn’t Knoblauch with the throws in 2005, unlike 2006),

    QuoSF January 17, 2007, 4:31 pm
  • I agree with you there, Lar. I also agree that it was a toss-up between the two players. I think the writer’s refusal to vote for Matsui hurt him, but the award could have gone either way. Also, I’m sure that the same writers will make the same accusations when the time comes for DM. Correction: if the time comes for DM. We would hope that they use the same moral highground for DM that they did for Matsui.

    Brad January 17, 2007, 4:33 pm
  • If those guys had votes in 2001 (and I know they rotate so probably not), presumably Suzuki suffered the same anti-NPB bias. It’s still not an anti-Yankee bias, unless there’s some evidence — a la George King not voting for Pedro in ’99 but voting for pitchers in previous years — where they actually voted for a Japanese player in the past for ROY. It seems like it was just Matsui’s bad luck to get stuck with writers who are unwilling to follow the rules of their own association. They should lose their votes for it.

    Paul SF January 17, 2007, 4:36 pm
  • FWIW, I don’t really care for RoY either way – other than the little mental masturbation it provides. For example, Teixeira, who I’m sure any team dying to have, didn’t win it (obviously).
    It was more of a curious thing – you can kind of argue that Ichiro came before Matsui, so the anti-NPB bias didn’t reach the tipping point though surely having an MVP season can’t hurt. Of course, it was really only two votes, so “bias” isn’t conclusive, but I was more under the notion that “anti-NPB costed him the RoY”, which you can (and I did) argue. I was more curious if this will now be a more consistent basis.
    Jeter will be in the Hall of Fame, MVP or not, so =)
    (Knocks on wood, and under the belief that if he doesn’t get injured, he’ll get 3000 hits)

    Lar January 17, 2007, 4:44 pm
  • brien taylor was gonna start the ’92 allstar game too.
    i’m officially starting the justin masterson hype machine. get on board now. he’s the next (your favorite pitchers name here)! yeah, he’s only faced 19 and 20 year olds, but that k/bb ratio spells HOFer to me. sure, he’s only pitched at lowell, but the sox are holding him back cause he’s that great.

    sf rod January 17, 2007, 4:45 pm
  • Look, Lar, I’ll agree with you and any YFs who think those “journalists” method of voting was bogus. But Matsui was not the consensus best candidate anyway.

    QuoSF January 17, 2007, 4:47 pm
  • lol, sf rod. I’m already on the Clay Buchholz bus.

    Paul SF January 17, 2007, 4:56 pm
  • i also hate when my fellow yankee fans proclaim hughes to be the future Yankee ace. i really hope he does well, and from what i’ve seen, he’s got the stuff. But proclaiming that he’s going to have better years than beckett is crazy. he might not even make it through AAA. Let’s all be calm and rational about this.

    m.g. yanks fan January 17, 2007, 4:57 pm
  • ARod wasn’t the consensus best candidate, but we still have you hear SF’s ;)
    More random stats:
    Win Shares:
    Hideki Matsui 14.47
    Angel Berroa 12.49
    And remember, Bob Hamelin was a RoY too.

    Lar January 17, 2007, 4:58 pm
  • So was current Red Sox backup infielder Eric Hinskie.

    Paul SF January 17, 2007, 5:03 pm
  • All right. Berroa won because of anti-JPL bias, anti-Yankee bias, and a love for everything the Royals did that season.
    DM could win just based on being on the Red Sox.

    Anonymous January 17, 2007, 5:10 pm
  • DM could win just based on being on the Red Sox.
    __________________
    Duh.

    Brad January 17, 2007, 5:21 pm
  • Forgot to mention who came in second to Bob Hamelin that year.. one ManRam..

    Lar January 17, 2007, 5:24 pm
  • “he might not even make it through AAA.”
    Barring serious injury that’s extremely unlikely. The difference in difficulty between AA and AAA is minimal. Some might even argue that AA is better because that’s where more talented prospects spend the most time, wheras AAA tends to have a lot of career minor leagures and “AAAA” players who never amount to a whole lot in the majors. Compared to the leap between A/AA and the minors/majors, the difference between AA and AAA is just not that significants. So I think it is pretty safe to say that Hughes will make it past AAA. Heck, on some other teams he would stand a fairly decent chance of making the major league rotation right out of spring training.

    Anonymous January 17, 2007, 5:29 pm
  • anon- you make a good point on the differences between the levels of minor league ball. the problem i have is…hughes got shelled during the AAA allstar game as well as not fairing well last spring training against AAA caliber players. who know’s what hughes will turn into at ML ranks, but why set up expectations that will be impossible to achieve? i think the term “mark prior lite” sets the bar at a reasonable level.

    sf rod January 17, 2007, 5:41 pm
  • Yankee fans do not back down from how you feel about Phillip Hughes. Yes there is a degree of uncertainty when it comes to young pitching prospects. The same “Noise” we are making now, is the same noise Red Sox fans made about Pap, Hansen, Lester, Pedroia, so on and so forth. Why are “Guesstimations” ok on the other thread for Pedroia and Dice K’s race for the ROY, but when Yankees fans speak of Hughes out come the Brien Taylor references. Truth is nobody knows how good he will be eventually, but for now he stock is pretty high in our eyes and in the eyes of the baseball world.
    Top 100 Prospects 2007
    1. Delmon Young (OF, TAM) 10D
    2. Alex Gordon (3B, KC) 9A
    3. Daisuke Matsuzaka (RHP, BOS) 9B
    4. Justin Upton (OF, ARI) 10E
    5. Homer Bailiey (RHP, CIN) 9B
    6. Philip Hughes (RHP, NYY) 9B
    7. Brandon Wood (SS, LAA) 9B
    8. Jay Bruce (OF, CIN) 9B
    9. Billy Butler (OF, KC) 9B
    10. Cameron Maybin (OF, DET) 9C

    Triskaidekaphobia January 17, 2007, 6:02 pm
  • “Matsui had 10 first place votes and lost by two points to Berroa. It’s not like Matsui was stricken from the balloting, like some here have made it sound.”
    …actually, you’re wrong about that paul, though he wasn’t “stricken” from voting officially…while i won’t jump on the yankee-bias bandwagon this time, there was significant discussion among sportscasters and sportswriters about whether matsui could really be considered a “rookie” given his age and experience as one of japan’s premier players…i’m not saying whether that was fair or not, but you need to recognize that sentiment may have colored some of the voting against him…

    dc January 17, 2007, 6:34 pm
  • Great point DC and that’s all I said in the other thread. If he lost due to stats, that’s fine. But if he lost because of sentiment towards Japanese Rookies, which may have very well been the case then it’s wrong. Either way, who cares do you think anyone in their right mind would rather have Angel Berroa right now??

    Triskaidekaphobia January 17, 2007, 6:39 pm
  • …right on tk…especially with the reference to unproven sox prospects being hyped…just like it’s ok to crack arod jokes, it’s not ok to poke fun at the sox, or hype yank prospects…the double-standard lives on, but don’t get discouraged…dig in and take your cuts…

    dc January 17, 2007, 6:42 pm
  • Trisk, I don’t understand what you’re talking about w/r/t Matsuzaka and Pedroia, whose stats have been projected well and are both assured of starting next season. They’ve each succeeded to whatever extents at levels Hughes has yet to reach.
    Hughes is a AA prospect. A very good prospect. One of the best in baseball, but he’s not going to be on the Opening Day 25, and I think the discussion over his talents reflects that additional uncertainty.

    Paul SF January 17, 2007, 6:45 pm
  • Besides, I’ve never seen Pedroia labeled the next Nellie Fox or Craig Biggio, and we’ve all been quite clear — at least on YFSF — how we are not expecting Matsuzaka to be the next Pedro. On the SOSH thread, and on this thread, Hughes has been described as likely to have a Clemens- and Pedro-like career and to have a better first five seasons than Beckett.
    There was certainly some hype over Hansen, but it’s hard to say he’s been advertised to such a degree as Hughes considering he was in MLB stinking it up less than a year after being drafted. Hard for the hype machine to really get revved up in that case.

    Paul SF January 17, 2007, 6:56 pm
  • …paul, i agree with your latest hughes comments 100%…it’s all about “potential”…a solid AA performance doesn’t guarantee the same success at subsequent levels, but all the yf’s are asking for is an opportunity to get excited about some young guys with “potential”…equal time with you sf’s for that spotlight…frankly, i get a little tired hearing about how the yankees only sign “aging, over-the-hill former stars to bloated contracts”, partly because it’s been true too often…it’s a nice change to be in a position to talk about guys like hughes, and guys who are already at the big league level, like melky and cano…let us have some fun…

    dc January 17, 2007, 6:57 pm
  • Trisk + DC – it’s a good point. There wasn’t much of a debate on Ichiro’s year, but for Matsui’s year, the “debate” of whether he was a rookie was all over media (and by that, I mean ESPN). It might’ve costed him some votes anyhow..
    Are we still talking about Hughes long-term or short-term? It’s apples and oranges for next year, maybe even 2008, but certainly it’s fair game long-term.

    Lar January 17, 2007, 6:59 pm
  • paul, you and i must have been posting at the same time…i don’t think i’ve seen anyone compare hughes to pedro or clemens…beckett, now that’s not such a tough one, and i did see that comparison…look, you may not remember the hype from last year about the sox youngsters, many of whom were forced into duty before they were ready, but it was loud and long…papelbon beat the odds, but you have to admit it was a risky experiment…the jury’s still out on the rest of the sox youth movement…

    dc January 17, 2007, 7:03 pm
  • the funny thing is I basically agree with Brad’s take on Hughes, although I seem to remember him being very excited about Sox pitching prospects such as Papelbon and Lester before they ever put on Boston uniforms. Hmm. Yanks fans are suddenly now allowed to get excited about their prospects. Meanwhile the salary gap closes between the two teams. Are we becoming each other?

    Nick-YF January 17, 2007, 7:50 pm
  • just like it’s ok to crack arod jokes, it’s not ok to poke fun at the sox, or hype yank prospects
    This is utter crap. I for one believe there’s plenty of reason to be excited about Hughes. He’s a primo prospect, obviously one of the best in the game. But touting a prospect and trying to understand a players’ potential (along with the risks inherent in being nothing more than an amazingly accomplished A-ball player) are different from simply assuming that there aren’t risks involved or assuming that a player’s “aceness” is a fait accompli. Hughes, it seems, has attained that “can’t miss” status. That’s a dangerous status to have, particularly for the fans. Ask Beckett, who though hasn’t really “missed” certainly isn’t a pitcher of the level that many people expected…yet. There are a few reasons to think that Hughes will excel immediately and never look back. There are almost as many, if not more, reasons to expect that he will excel in time, and there are a handful of reasons to expect that he will flame out. The first scenario is possible but unlikely, the second seems quite probable, the third unfortunate but also a possibility. This isn’t a potshot at Hughes; it’s a fact about up-and-coming baseball players.
    And feel free to take plenty of potshots at Sox’ prospects, if you like, as long as they are reasonable and critical. I do it myself, and hopefully it’s because of a sense of realism; hot prospects rarely pan out and turn into stars, in truth. In a league of over 300 pitchers (and countless numbers in the minors), how many aces are there?

    SF January 17, 2007, 8:54 pm
  • I am not saying by any stretch of the imagination that Hughes will be the next Rocket, Nolan Ryan, etc…All I am saying is let the Yankees fans have their excitement. It’s absolutely refreshing to have a guy on the horizon that has the possiblity of being very good. I am only 31, so in my lifetime there hasn’t been too many Philip Hughes….I am not taking pot shots at any of the Sox prospects, they are all legit from what I have read, so where that came from I have no clue. My point was if it’s ok for optimism for the Sox youngsters, there can be equal if not greater optimism for the Yankees youngsters.

    Triskaidekaphobia January 17, 2007, 9:08 pm
  • “Besides, I’ve never seen Pedroia labeled the next Nellie Fox or Craig Biggio, and we’ve all been quite clear — at least on YFSF — how we are not expecting Matsuzaka to be the next Pedro.”
    Paul that’s the beauty of this sport and the teams we choose to root for….If you think that Dustin or Dice K are the best thing since sliced bread, stand up and say it proud and loud. All I am asking for is the same rights. What I think of Philip Hughes means squadoosh, but if it makes Yankees fans happy to think he on his way to stardom, let it be. Someday, not long from now we will all have our answer. Remember it wasn’t too long ago Yankee fans and the team itself were getting bashed for buying talent and having an empty talent pool and farm system.

    Triskaidekaphobia January 17, 2007, 9:16 pm
  • Triskaidekaphobia January 17, 2007, 10:06 pm
  • Hughes. He’s been dominant at every level. Command of 3 pitches, not including his slider. Throws in the mid 90s with late life. Good head. May take a season or two to get his bearings, but barring injury, it’s a very bright future. Whee!

    YF January 17, 2007, 11:22 pm
  • …sf, nobody is taking potshots at the sox prospects [here anyway]…and nobody has said that hughes “can’t miss”, that’s your extrapolation of yf comments about his potential, as are the comparisons to clemens and pedro…if sf’s can continue to hype beckett [last year he was supposed to contend for the cy young with shilling, as i recall from the sox spring training reports] after his continued “misses” [despite the notable ws mvp exception for 1 particular game against the yanks], there’s room to hype hughes a bit…that’s all anyone is saying here…

    dc January 17, 2007, 11:26 pm
  • 1. Berroa deserved to beat out Matsui for the RoY award. The two writers who refused to vote for Matsui ’cause he wasn’t a “true rookie” were wrong, but the voters ended up getting it right (for the wrong reasons, perhaps, but hey). Berroa was a SS, Matsui a LF. That’s a HUGE difference. Much the same as, oh, say, the difference between a 1B and a C or SS. Not that MVP voters understand that, of course.
    2. I’m sick of the Hughes hype. Enough. He hasn’t thrown a pitch above AA. Of course I hope he’s all that and a bag ‘o chips, but the sky-high expectations worry me. Just let him pitch.

    Rob (Middletown, CT) January 18, 2007, 9:11 am
  • May take a season or two to get his bearings, but barring injury, it’s a very bright future. Whee
    ________________________
    A season or two? When was the last time NY put up with two bad seasons from anyone? This kid better bring his plus stuff right away, otherwise, we know what will start happening to him if he gets knocked around for a year (or two). Just ask A-Rod. NY has created a machine of hype and amazement for this kid, now all he has to do is live up to it. Should be easy enough.

    Brad January 18, 2007, 9:24 am
  • rob, on your #1, ….i don’t don’t think the argument was about berroa’s qualifications…even as a yf, i’d have had a hard time picking against him…i think the debate was over writers inconsistency in determining who is a rookie…if they follow the mentality they did with matsui, it could hurt dm in the voting [assuming he has a ROY kind of year]…
    …do you mean that in spite of their incompetence, the writers tripped over the right answer?…hmm, maybe murray chass is onto something with some of his wild ideas, hmm
    on your #2, i agree, way too much hype from some…a nice conservative reserved hype does seem appropriate however…and yep, let him pitch before we crown him 08’s cy young…

    dc January 18, 2007, 9:53 am
  • dc, the problem, as I see it, is the rotation of the voting rights for postseason awards. Those two writers were dumb, and their dumbness didn’t heart the other NPB ROY candidates because they didn’t have ROY votes at the time (or so I assume). Unless they coincidentally have the vote again this year, Matsuzaka might not see any effect.
    It would be more fair to the players to have all the current eligible baseball writers vote — so all the stupidity is either dilluted or at least counts against all the players all the time, but that would be hundreds of ballots. And to have the same group vote year after year would be unfair to other writers. Catch 22, as it always seems to be with these awards.

    Paul SF January 18, 2007, 10:35 am
  • dc,
    “…do you mean that in spite of their incompetence, the writers tripped over the right answer?”
    Yep, that’s what I was trying to say. They do that sometimes. It still irritates me, because I know the process was wrong, but it’s better than wrong process + wrong answer.

    Rob (Middletown, CT) January 18, 2007, 11:25 am

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