The Yanks Get Pudgier

IRod and ARod, sitting in a tree

Didn’t see this one coming.

86 comments… add one

  • for Krazy Kyle… that works for me.

    attackgerbil July 30, 2008, 4:44 pm
  • Pudge for… KYLE FARNSWORTH??
    Brian Cashman, you a muthaf*ckin’ genius.

    doug YF July 30, 2008, 4:44 pm
  • Cash is doing a great job this deadline. No doubt, Steinbrothers are not wanting to fade into the night in the last year in Yankee stadium.
    Farnsworth going to close in Detroit?
    What a nice piece to have off the bench – one of the best catchers of all time riding pine for when you need him.
    Epstein is getting crushed. I feel like I did when they didn’t pony up for Abreu. What in the fcuk are they waiting for – pull some triggers for @$#(*&^ sake.

    Brad July 30, 2008, 4:46 pm
  • So they replaced Posada with Posada.
    Pretty good move at the cost of just Farnsworth.
    Pretty damn good indeed.

    LocklandSF July 30, 2008, 4:47 pm
  • Have the Yankees given up one actual player they or their fans had twinges of regret for giving up in return for Xavier Nady, Damaso Marte and Ivan Rodriguez? I submit not.
    I hate to admit it, but Theo’s vaunted “creativity” is looking mighty dull right now.

    Paul SF July 30, 2008, 4:48 pm
  • I mean, I think Marte was a good move (Nady is a mediocre player having a good year), but this is a great move by Cashman. A great move. And just in time to gun down a few Angels at the stadium.
    Epstein better have something in the works here, or he’s going to get fleeced.

    Brad July 30, 2008, 4:48 pm
  • Wow. Detroit saves 2.6 Million. Once again, proving my theory: Detroit doesn’t know what they are doing.

    walein July 30, 2008, 4:48 pm
  • Posada wishes he had Pudge’s arm.

    Brad July 30, 2008, 4:49 pm
  • > Farnsworth going to close in Detroit?
    Jones’ demotion lands the Yankees Pudge. Why does this make me smile?

    attackgerbil July 30, 2008, 4:49 pm
  • Is Steve Phillips running Detroit? They toss out two years of terrible for four months of good when they looked at Farnsworth?
    Wow did they get robbed. I hope Cashman sends them a Christmas card for their generosity in this matter.

    Brad July 30, 2008, 4:52 pm
  • I always said the Yanks would get I_Rod when he was old and not hitting, but I had no idea I’d be correct, and I had no idea that I’d be so pissed about it when it happened because it makes such a little difference for them, and there is absolutely no negative side to the deal.

    Brad July 30, 2008, 4:54 pm
  • Cash just upped his asking price a notch.

    walein July 30, 2008, 4:55 pm
  • I don’t really think this matters that much, since Pudge is definitely not what he was, and I do think this hurts the bullpen in NY, but having a guy like that on the bench or platooning when you play a fast team is an awesome advantage to have. A guy who can shoot guys out at second is a huge deal when you play the Angels, Sox and every single NL team.

    Brad July 30, 2008, 4:56 pm
  • The Marte part of the Pirates trade makes perfect sense now.

    attackgerbil July 30, 2008, 4:56 pm
  • Getting Marte didn’t make sense before, AG? I mean, I was under the impression, and still am, that deal was the best one any team could have made. Nady is not that good outside of this year, but Marte is just freaking awesome (last night not withstanding).
    That move made sense from the start if you ask me – no matter if they needed him or not.

    Brad July 30, 2008, 4:58 pm
  • Pudge’s arm isn’t what it used to be, and he no longer has much pop, but he still hits for average. This is a good move made GREAT by shedding Farnsworth in the process.

    yankees76 July 30, 2008, 4:58 pm
  • I’m feelin’ that 2006 vibe…but at least this time it’s just a year removed from a World Series victory (as opposed to the two years’ distance last time–spoiled!).

    Devine July 30, 2008, 4:59 pm
  • You’re exactly right, Walein. What a great move if he uses him correctly.

    Brad July 30, 2008, 4:59 pm
  • Plus, I’m pretty sure you’ll get better draft picks for I_Rod than you will Farnsworth when they let him walk at the end of the year.

    Brad July 30, 2008, 5:00 pm
  • “Pudge’s arm isn’t what it used to be”
    but still better than most catchers, and a good number of outfielders, and possibly some pitchers.

    Brad July 30, 2008, 5:01 pm
  • Brad, the Yankees only get draft picks if they offer him arbitration, which they might, since it’s not clear how Posada will come back from surgery, but it would be expensive for them if he accepts. Maybe it will be one of those “wink and nod” situations, where the Yankees offer him arbitration on the condition that he not accept, but we’ll see.

    yankees76 July 30, 2008, 5:03 pm
  • Right on, 76.
    I forgot about the arbitration thing.

    Brad July 30, 2008, 5:04 pm
  • Molina is having a flukey-good year behind the dish, but for whatever it’s worth, he’s doing a significantly better job than Pudge catching baserunners this year.
    Of course, he can’t hit a lick.

    yankees76 July 30, 2008, 5:05 pm
  • So they replaced Posada with Posada
    How is these even a remotely fair comparison? Posada is a far better player than Pudge (when healthy). Or is Pudge the equivalent of an out-for-the-year Posada?

    SF July 30, 2008, 5:06 pm
  • I think this trade was sealed when Girardi had to bring Mo in for five outs last week in Fenway. Granted, one of those hits was a nubber up the baseline, but still ….

    yankees76 July 30, 2008, 5:08 pm
  • Wouldn’t you think Pudge is the starting catcher now with Molina backing him up??? Not sad to see farnsy go…

    krueg July 30, 2008, 5:10 pm
  • Greedy Red Sox fans come out. Seriously, why do the Sox have to respond to EVERY Yankee move with one of their own? I don’t love the way the Sox are put together right now, but what are the options? To dump Michael Bowden for a rental catcher who probably wouldn’t play in front of Tek anyways? What can they get for Coco Crisp? Are they supposed to dump Jacoby Ellsbury back to AAA and perhaps stunt his development because he is hurting them right now? Should they dump a guy like Masterson for a middle reliever who may be a crapshoot as it is? Was he supposed to trade the pitching future for Mark Texeira, or trade Youk for someone who is perhaps walking after the season?
    Seriously, Sox fans, please realize that it isn’t like Theo can just snap his fingers and fix this team. They have won two WS in four years. In 2006 Theo “sat on his hands”, and for GOOD F*CKING REASON, no deal he would have made would have salvaged that season and it may have wrecked our chances in 2007. I’d rather have Theo trade guys like Tek and Crisp for youngsters and see what a little energy can do, if he is going to make a move, which I am not sure he even will. I am not interested in this team getting older and slower, I can handle doing that on my own.

    SF July 30, 2008, 5:12 pm
  • Devine –
    You’re exactly right. The Red Sox, if no move is made for a bullpen guy or another big bat, have once again give us the big piss off.
    “Thanks for spending a small fortune for everything Red Sox related” but we just can’t seem to reach a deal for the parts we need this year, and hopefully, we’ll be able to address these issues in the offeseason. ”
    You know, when Manny is off the books, and we have to make a huge move because he’s now playing for our biggest rivalry, and we’d rather not lose by ten games since they probably signed Sheets as well.

    Brad July 30, 2008, 5:12 pm
  • They knew they needed someone to help Molina handle the second half (Molina hasn’t played more than 80 games in a long time), Chad Moeller wasn’t going to cut it. Plus, they get out of Farnsworth who has never really worked out in NY (he has been good recently). I think Ramirez’ strong relief pitching helped with this move, and the last reliever trade.

    walein July 30, 2008, 5:14 pm
  • First of all, I’m not a greedy fan, and I’m not asking for a Pudge type move. In fact, I’m in complete agreement with you. Trade old parts for new.
    I’m not asking for a response at all to this Yankee move. I don’t really think it makes that big of a difference, but regardless, it makes them better than they were. That’s all I’m asking for from Theo. I’m asking for a move. Something. Anything. Just freaking make some kind of move to improve a team that doesn’t have to be circling the drain the way it is right now.

    Brad July 30, 2008, 5:16 pm
  • This was a shocker to me (I took off looking at sports after the Yanks won..)
    Wow. I might be one of the few people who like Farns, so I don’t know. I guess getting Marte allowed this move to be made..

    Lar July 30, 2008, 5:18 pm
  • You’re exactly right. The Red Sox, if no move is made for a bullpen guy or another big bat, have once again give us the big piss off.
    “Thanks for spending a small fortune for everything Red Sox related” but we just can’t seem to reach a deal for the parts we need this year, and hopefully, we’ll be able to address these issues in the offeseason. “

    How utterly spoiled you are. The Sox don’t do what it takes? Are you serious? Have they not won? What about last year’s big move, how did that work out for the players involved? Sure, it showed the front office “cares”, but isn’t it evidence that just making a move doesn’t prove or guarantee anything?
    My God, you sound like a Yankees fan.
    (sorry, Yankee fans, that is done for effect)

    SF July 30, 2008, 5:18 pm
  • Sorry SF, I meant a winged but still playing Posada.

    LocklandSF July 30, 2008, 5:19 pm
  • This trade may be worth it just for the RSN in-fighting it has caused.

    walein July 30, 2008, 5:20 pm
  • Ellsbury
    Buchholz
    Masterson
    Bowden
    Lowrie
    Crisp
    Casey
    Kotteras
    Lars
    Carter.
    Why stock them if you aren’t going to move any of them? You think all of them are going to pan out – or any of them are EVER going to equal what you could have if you pony up for Holiday or Tex?
    Maybe I’m just talking out of a lack of moves, or the fact that Manny is still on this team. Or the fact that I haven’t heard a single trade rumor that was A)real or B) made any sense whatsoever.
    Hopefully something is on the horizon.

    Brad July 30, 2008, 5:21 pm
  • SF- while I agree with you that it’s hard to see what moves Theo could make, surely you understand us all having a little expressive freakout about the Yanks getting a bit better?
    In the meantime, while I hope that Theo pulls something good out of his ass, I have to tip my cap to Cashman for a great month. And, of course, who knows if he’s done…

    stuck working July 30, 2008, 5:23 pm
  • Of course, that was said, but I was responding before I read all the comments. =)
    Can we just resign Cashman now? I mean, sure, some moves haven’t panned out (Pavano, Hughes/IPK this year..) but ya, most of the time it’s in the right direction though..

    Lar July 30, 2008, 5:23 pm
  • OK, Brad, fine – what are the moves the Sox should make? Who should they dump? Who is available? Should they have trade for Harden? Blanton? Marte? What if Pittsburgh said “hey, we’ll give you Marte but for nothing less than Masterson and Kalish”, would you do it? What would the short-term benefit be to the team? Would Marte be such an enormous upgrade over the internal options? Should the Sox dump Buchholz and Lowrie for Matt Holliday and his pending enormous contract at age 29/30?
    My one big desire is for the Sox to throw something at Texas for Salty or a comparable catching prospect. But that’s a seller’s market and you can be damn sure if there’s an opportunity for Theo in that direction it involves a decision with a combination of Buchholz, Masterson, Bowden, and Lowrie, if not one starting with three or all of them.
    So what’s the move?

    SF July 30, 2008, 5:24 pm
  • I’m not all that psyched about this…other than the fact that farnsy (or farnsdouche as the wife and I call him) is gone. Pretty sure Pudge can’t pitch…

    krueg July 30, 2008, 5:25 pm
  • Yeah, sorry I want the Sox to make a move to get better and fully understand the idea that they have to give to get.
    It’s not being spoiled. It’s being realistic about the process.
    And, I didn’t start calling your profane names, so don’t start in with me.
    You’re probably right. I probably am spoiled for not wanting to finish third once again this year. Regardless of last year, I would like to win again. I mean, I did go my whole childhood rooting for a terrible team, but this whole winning thing has been nice. So yeah, maybe I am spoiled.
    Again, no need to call names.

    Brad July 30, 2008, 5:26 pm
  • I’m just looking for a little creativity, something that will make the team better, even a little bit. It doesn’t have to be a reaction move or a desperation move, but a well planned move that makes sense and makes up better. Not just moves for the sake of moves. Granted, some times the best move is no move at all, but I don’t think that’s the case right now.
    I like winning and I want to keep winning.

    LocklandSF July 30, 2008, 5:26 pm
  • “So what’s the move?”
    If I knew that, I would be the GM of a MLB team.

    LocklandSF July 30, 2008, 5:27 pm
  • You guys ARE Yankee-fan-esque!!!

    krueg July 30, 2008, 5:28 pm
  • Four of those guys you listed are playing every day (or starting or relieving on the Major League level).
    Sean Casey is a bench player. Carter is a mid-level prospect, Coco Crisp appears to be an all-glove, no-hit backup outfielder when playing for a good team, a mediocrity if playing full-time for a low-level squad. Kotteras, if he was worth anything, would probably be up with the big club, and Bowden may be in Boston soon. Lars, I don’t know about.
    I have an idea: Theo should call up everyone in the Majors and say “hey, what’ll you give me for Sean Casey, George Kotteras, and Chris Carter package”. When he gets the answer he can spend the next hour figuring out what the hell he is going to do with 144 resin bags and a batting practice pitcher’s guard.

    SF July 30, 2008, 5:28 pm
  • My jaw literally dropped when I saw this. The Marte trade did make sense when it was made because he was a lefty, but it also didn’t make sense because their bullpen of rightis was already effective against lefty bats and because Marte was much more (and much pricier) than a lefty specialist. Now, as AG says, it makes perfect sense all the way around.
    Regardless of any drop-off in Pudge’s game, the Yankees had taxed Molina like crazy already and Moeller just is not comforting as a back-up. Pudge with Molina as a back-up? Now that is nice. And I like having Mr. Scary-Intesity on the team. I love this move.

    IronHorse (yf) July 30, 2008, 5:28 pm
  • hmmmm….so this means edwar or veras for the 8th? girardi seems pretty locked in on marte being a loogy.
    cash has been able to shed the yanks of two tumors (kyle/tabata) in less than a week. well played brian, well played.
    brandon inge should write cash a thank you letter.

    sf rod July 30, 2008, 5:30 pm
  • Even if IRod hits 270 with little power, he’s definitely an offensive upgrade over Molina, and definitely defensively, as much as a wiz Molina was. The “black hole” that was the bottom 3 is getting smaller and smaller, especially if Matsui really is coming back..

    Lar July 30, 2008, 5:31 pm
  • SF –
    I’m not trying to argue with you, man. I’m really not. I’m not trying to play GM either. All I’m saying is that the Yanks have gotten sig better in the last week and didn’t give up shit to do so. That’s a credit to Cashman.
    Yes, I would have traded for Tex. Yes, I would move for Holiday. His impending contract be damned. The Red Sox’ payroll is the last thing on my mind. They pay Lugo TEN MILLION DOLLARS A YEAR. I have to have a grand to catch a weekend series in Boston, and I live forty five minutes away.
    Don’t go down the salary road for the sake of making arguements based on making moves.
    I get ABSOLUTELY NOHTING if the Red Sox payroll drops one penny. Nothing. They’re not lowering prices on games or jerseys. I could care less what it costs to sign Tex or Holiday or Sheets or any other player.

    Brad July 30, 2008, 5:33 pm
  • > Getting Marte didn’t make sense before, AG? I mean
    Yes, it did make sense. I didn’t offer much when I made that statement. I guess what I was trying to express was that Kyle has been having (in my opinion) a pretty good year and I was surprised that they were bringing in a pitcher that has the talent to serve the same purpose at this time in the form of Marte, but now I see (or at least surmise) that it was part of another agenda.

    attackgerbil July 30, 2008, 5:36 pm
  • I just can’t believe this. Apparently the 2006 non-moves didn’t register.
    Interesting, from a chat with Edes just after the 2006 deadline came and went:
    The trade deadline has come and gone and Theo talks about his plan and not mortgaging the future for today. He does not want to trade prospects for established players. All well and good, but then how do you explain the players we had targeted (Abreu, Lidle, Shealy and Lugo) going for NOTHING!! I’m all for hanging on to prospects, but if the Sox are going to be too cheap to grab the players they need, worse yet, let the go to the Yankees, then I have a problem.
    Doug Berlin, Jamestown, NY

    Just press rewind, I guess, and ignore the smarts that Theo showed holding his cards.

    SF July 30, 2008, 5:36 pm
  • IH, no opinion on the character of Pudge? I mean, he’s not the nicest guy, supposedly. And, of course, there are other things that may or may not have gone down.
    But who are you to judge, right?

    SF July 30, 2008, 5:37 pm
  • LocklandSF July 30, 2008, 5:38 pm
  • definitely a good move for the Yanks. Maybe a good one for the Tigers. Given the Yanks’ bullpen depth, this deal carries very little risk. And Pudge is a big upgrade over Molina. Add the fact that he might yield a first draft pick and wow! The Tigers, on the other hand, have Brandon Inge, who is not much of a downgrade from Pudge, and they needed a reliever with Zumaya’s continuing issues and Jones’ demotion. Really, Oudge is not a big loss for them, and the last time Farnsworth was with them, he was lights out. They might feel they can work with him to get back to that point.

    Nick-YF July 30, 2008, 5:38 pm
  • I’m not sure what trade the Sox should make, but I’m not paid big bucks to be the general manager of the Red Sox. Who here would have thought up a three-way trade for Dave Roberts, Doug Mientkiewicz and Orlando Cabrera for Nomar Garciaparra in 2004?
    It’s a simultaneous expression of trust and frustration. We trust that Theo has the smarts and creativity to get a smart deal done that improves the team, so we’re frustrated when nothing happens, regardless of how easily apparent any such deal may be.
    I’m pretty sure, though, the Sox have a package of prospects that can roughly equal Tabata, Karstens, etc. Unless teams are asking for a lot more from the Sox than they are from the Yanks…
    Also, apparently the Royals have offered, straight up, Ron Mahay for Brandon Moss. I think I’d do that deal.

    Paul SF July 30, 2008, 5:39 pm
  • It could go either way, SF. But at some point, a GM has to say to himself: Team A, which is already incredible just got a LOT better (the Angels I mean), and the other great team in our division is making small moves to get better in areas they are struggling.
    At some point, something has to be done. If they trade Manny, I’ll eat the idea that they’re playing for this year, but if they keep Manny, and don’t make any moves to improve, that makes no sense at all.
    If they think they’re good enough right now (which you and I both know they are not), then I can understand holding still, but there is NO WAY Theo thinks this.
    EEI is reporting that talks have heated back up between Pitt and TB for Bay. I mean, the Red Sox just can’t compete here. You can’t walk into the TB clubhouse without bumping into a number one pick or awesome talent making 250g a year.

    Brad July 30, 2008, 5:42 pm
  • We trust that Theo has the smarts and creativity to get a smart deal done that improves the team, so we’re frustrated when nothing happens, regardless of how easily apparent any such deal may be.
    Or the smarts and creativity (and foresight) to NOT make a deal despite the pressure. Making moves isn’t the only sign of a smart and shrewd GM, surely that’s a ridiculously simplistic yardstick to measure success, by the success of moves made.
    I sort of recall a lot of Sox fans touting Theo’s smarts when he let Pedro walk. This isn’t much different. I guess I am mostly alone here, though.

    SF July 30, 2008, 5:44 pm
  • You sure the Yanks would get a first rounder, Nick?

    SF July 30, 2008, 5:45 pm
  • Letting Pedro walk was the most obvious move he ever made, SF. That’s a terrible comparison to not making a move to improve the team at a time when it needs improving and there are parts with which you could yeild those results.
    You’re not alone. I don’t want him to do something stupid knowing that he can just say “it didn’t work the way we planned it”, but I would like to see a move made.
    I’m just ranting, and not in response to Cashman’s great move, but more in response to the idea that I think moves will not be made in Boston.

    Brad July 30, 2008, 5:47 pm
  • Also, I think the comparison to 2006 is only half-relevant. 2006 was pretty clearly a rebuilding year: Keep the prospects and retool during the offseason to start another “dynasty” starting in 2007/08. The Sox are one year removed from the World Series now; there is no rebuilding to do. The youngsters are here and mostly ready (except in the bullpen), and the veterans are producing at or above last year’s level. Yet the Sox are still doing a disturbing imitation of ’06. But unlike ’06, they aren’t in rebuilding mode, which means they should be in win mode.
    You’re right, SF. I don’t know what move they should make. But the team as consituted does not look playoffs worthy right now. There are several key holes (bullpen, catcher, bottom of the lineup), and there are plenty of prospects available to patch those holes without sacrificing Bowden and Masterson or Kalish and Anderson. At least in ’06, we knew Theo had tried to trade for Oswalt and other key pieces. We’re hearing nothing of the sort here, and that as a fan is frustrating.

    Paul SF July 30, 2008, 5:48 pm
  • Dear fellow Red Sox brethren:
    I know it’s very, very hard to sit and watch other teams make big trades while your team does nothing. But, Jesus, I do not advocate making a trade for the sake of making a trade.
    Yes, this team has been scuffling since the all-star break. It’s also played a very tough schedule and had to deal with Manny latest return to adolescence. But the sked starts to get easier, there’s more home games and TB’s sked starts to get harder. I am not convinced – at this time – that this is anything more than a slump.
    SO CALM DOWN!!!
    Remember how nuts this site was last year the day Suzyn peed her pants at the sight of Roger in Stein’s box? How’d THAT work out?
    Yes, Nady and Muerte help NYY, but IRod just stabilizes the catching position. He’s not the IRod of old. Losing Farnsy (never thought I’d say this) is a pretty big hit.
    AND … other than the Nomie 2004 blockbuster, Theo hasn’t exactly set a standard of excellence on deadline deals.
    There’s 22 hours and 15 minute left before the non-waiver trade deadline.
    JUST CALM THE HELL DOWN.

    I'm Bill McNeal July 30, 2008, 5:48 pm
  • okay, I’m out.

    Brad July 30, 2008, 5:48 pm
  • >the Yanks would get a first rounder
    If he declines arbitration. He’s Type A after the season.

    attackgerbil July 30, 2008, 5:49 pm
  • Watch Pudge accept arbitration. HEHE!!!

    LocklandSF July 30, 2008, 5:49 pm
  • SF- a lot of the expressions of anxiety here are not judgments; they’re just expressions of anxiety. We’ll all make our reasoned judgments after the deadline has passed. In the meantime, with the Sox barely avoiding a no-hitter last night and now trying to avoid a sweep on a day the Yanks and Rays have already won, can you excuse people indulging a little freak-out/wish-fulfillment about the team getting better?

    stuck working July 30, 2008, 5:50 pm
  • “Add the fact that he might yield a first draft pick and wow!”
    He MIGHT Brad. And he might not. I don’t think that’s guaranteed. … checking stats real quick … Although a quick review of his stats for this year reveals that it might be more possible than I first thought.
    Here’s what I don’t like about it from your end, Farnsy has been a big part of that pen.

    I'm Bill McNeal July 30, 2008, 5:52 pm
  • We’re hearing nothing of the sort here, and that as a fan is frustrating.
    You mean except for the Manny stuff, that he’s waived his no-trade clause, the rumors about discussions with the Dodgers, the Phillies, the Marlins, the rumors that the Rockies asked for Buchholz and Lowrie for Fuentes? I mean, everyone seems to already have amnesia about the last week.
    I am with Bill. I don’t love the team as currently composed, but really, what is there to do? Bench Tek is where I’d start, but that sounds like the reactionary rant of a frustrated fan, since that’s just not going to happen with our manager.

    SF July 30, 2008, 5:53 pm
  • can you excuse people indulging a little freak-out/wish-fulfillment about the team getting better?
    Of course. But I’d rather it not be over the Yankees trading a modestly important piece of the strongest part of their team this year for a singles hitting catcher whose ability far trails his reputation. The reaction is not commensurate with the goings-on. And moreso, we have a really recent lesson (or lessons) in 2006 (non-moves) and 2007 (Eric Gagne) about deadline maneuvers. So the reactions surprise me, at least a little bit.

    SF July 30, 2008, 5:57 pm
  • Maybe I’m doing this wrong. … ?
    Anyway …
    I know the Sox anticipated that Gagme would be a Type A but he was so much suckage that he became a Type B.
    I doubt that IRod go to such extreme suckage levels.

    I'm Bill McNeal July 30, 2008, 5:58 pm
  • If the Yankees offer arbitration then Pudge would be an idiot to turn it down.

    SF July 30, 2008, 5:59 pm
  • Gotta run.
    A buddy who is battling cancer is coming over tonight so I’m proably out of commission on the game thread.
    Have fun and, for God’s sake CALM DOWN!!!

    I'm Bill McNeal July 30, 2008, 6:01 pm
  • SF- Again, I think the context matters here. If other folks are like me, events since the All-Star Break have caused a bit of a re-evaluation of how good this team actually is. Losing five games to the Angels, the Manny situation, other teams making deals — that all goes into it. It’s not about Pudge per se, since I doubt most people on the board think that deal does anything more than improve the Yankees by a game or two over the rest of the season. But given that the Sox are currently only 1.5 games ahead of the Yankees, that small improvement could mean a lot.
    Now, all that said, getting Manny and Papi in the line-up together consistently could take care of most of these problems and Masterson may yet prove himself in relief, so it’s not like all hope is lost. But it’s a bit…anxiety-producing.

    stuck working July 30, 2008, 6:02 pm
  • “Also, apparently the Royals have offered, straight up, Ron Mahay for Brandon Moss. I think I’d do that deal.”
    Probably. There’s no place for Moss in Boston and he’s out of options next year.

    I'm Bill McNeal July 30, 2008, 6:03 pm
  • Maybe SF’s right about this whole thing. In fact, I’m pretty sure he is. But I don’t like it when the Yankees make moves that look good while the Red Sox don’t do anything. Never have. Never will. We’ll see how it goes.

    Paul SF July 30, 2008, 6:04 pm
  • “But it’s a bit…anxiety-producing.”
    Take a few deep breaths.
    In. Out.
    In. Out.
    There. You’ll be fine.

    I'm Bill McNeal July 30, 2008, 6:05 pm
  • that deal does anything more than improve the Yankees by a game or two over the rest of the season
    Looking at it rationally, the only way I-Rod improves the Yankees by that drastic amount (10-20 runs gained or prevented or some combination thereof) is if Molina also goes down — in which case Rodriguez would be a several-win improvement over whatever Javy Lopez-style replacement the Yanks would be able to find on short notice.
    The more I think about the Farnsworth-I-Rod trade, the more I wonder if the Yankees didn’t give up too much. Farnsworth at his 2008 level is worth far more in a pennant race than a sub-.300-OBP catcher with a good arm.

    Paul SF July 30, 2008, 6:07 pm
  • “Farnsworth at his 2008 level is worth far more in a pennant race than a sub-.300-OBP catcher with a good arm.”
    Except Pudge, since the beginning of June, has been reaching base at a .395 clip. He’s a big improvement on Molina. This was a move borne out of necessity because Molina should not start on a team trying to reach the pennant race and struggling on offense. And Farnsworth has been good, not great, not even very good, and the pen has replacements for him.

    Nick-YF July 30, 2008, 6:14 pm
  • Paul, I don’t think it’s unreasonable to assume that Molina would have “gone down” at some point since, as I recall, it’s been quite awhile since he carried a full-time load for a long stretch. Even if there’s a less-than-even chance of that worst case scenario, some effort at preventing it seems reasonable given the cost of its occurrence. Now, is giving up Farnsworth too much to do that? I don’t think it’s blindingly obvious, but I do think that the Yankees improved overall, even if the trade doesn’t do much to improve their JMR (Jerk-to-Mensch Ratio).

    stuck working July 30, 2008, 6:14 pm
  • Except Pudge, since the beginning of June, has been reaching base at a .395 clip. He’s a big improvement on Molina. This was a move borne out of necessity because Molina should not start on a team trying to reach the pennant race and struggling on offense. And Farnsworth has been good, not great, not even very good, and the pen has replacements for him.
    Different things in here:
    1. I-Rod’s OBP over the last three seasons is .290-.332-.294. The fact that he’s had a hot month to get his OBP back up to what is essentially his peak level since 2004 wouldn’t instill much confidence in me going forward.
    2. No question he’s a big improvement on Molina. Even if his OPS+ drops to last year’s 85, that’s 35 better than Molina.
    3. Farnsworth is posting a Yankee-career-high ERA+ this season (113) and has essentially matched his strikeout total from last year in 20 fewer games. Not that 113 is great for a middle reliever (I actually thought he was better than that), but I think it’s decent enough, particularly since it’s dragged down a bit by his poor performance last night (which followed 10 consecutive scoreless appearances).

    Paul SF July 30, 2008, 6:24 pm
  • Paul, I am not saying I am “right”, I am not asserting that I know the right move/non-move. I am simply surprised by the vehement “WE NEED TO MAKE A MOVE NOW!” and “Theo needs to show us he cares” kind of comments. I find those reactionary, as people have admitted they are.

    SF July 30, 2008, 6:26 pm
  • “IH, no opinion on the character of Pudge?”
    Well if he misbehaves I certainly know who can get me a pair of rose-tinted glasses. At least until his performance really falls off – then I might have to say something. Or maybe not.
    Seriously SF, if you want to carry that endless debate into other threads like this one we can, but I’d suggest not. First, I don’t think either of us or any of the visitors to this site will enjoy where it goes and second, there are no fewer than 7 separate threads this week alone on the dreadlocked baffoon so if you really want to continue that one, there are plenty of other places for it. I found our debate tiresome and bordering on nasty at times and assume you did too. So try not to bait me here or elsewhere with it, OK?
    As for how big a trade this is, I agree with all the sentiment here that I-Rod is clearly not what he was, but from my perspective there were two truths about the Yankees that make this trade a very good move for NY:
    1. At 69 games, Molina is already close to catching the most he has ever caught in a season (78) and the backup – Chad Moeller – does not inspire confidence.
    2. The Yankee bullpen has succeeded largely based on contributions from multiple arms, not overdependence on any one. Erkel, Veras, Marte, and soon-to-return Bruney are all good options for late relief and I could see any of the last three taking the 8th inning spot based on performance going forward.
    Getting I-Rod is certainly not like getting Teixera was for LA. But it fits this particular team at this particular time nicely right now.

    IronHorse (yf) July 30, 2008, 6:28 pm
  • Yo, I am totally not freaking out. I think quite probably the best move is to hold tight and wait for the team to improve from this drastically bad last couple weeks (they are not nearly this bad), though I wouldn’t say no to bullpen help that doesn’t cost far too much in farm talent.
    Or a catcher that sucks a bit less.
    But I’ve been taking all the losing a lot more philosophically recently (the Joba/Beckett start was my last major loss freak-out), and if they lose out on October this year, it’s not the end of the world. And if doing nothing helps the team next year…okay.
    Meantime, I say we keep throwing Ellsbury and Buchholz out there (though if things are tight in September, maybe not Buchholz). Have we learned nothing from Lester? Sure, for ages it sucked watching him pitch, but the last three months have been GOLDEN.

    Devine July 30, 2008, 6:34 pm
  • I just don’t see how Kyle Farnsworth would have been such a valuable part of a Yanks pennant run, given his volatility. He was the 8th inning guy but he shouldn’t have been. You lose some depth in the bullpen, but you get better arms (Marte, Veras and Ramirez) is more high leverage situations. That works for me.
    Add Pudge, who is now on a 2-month hot streak, and will improve the dire catching situation, and I don’t know how you could have given a lot of thought to this trade and wondered that the Yanks might have given up too much.

    Nick-YF July 30, 2008, 6:34 pm
  • I would now like to see Marte set up. He has done it before and done it well.
    Never been a fan of Pudge but I like the deal from all angles.

    John - YF July 30, 2008, 6:49 pm
  • sox fans negative about the irod deal are pissed that theo didn’t make a deal to get him to replace their own d-list catcher…uh, what’s that?. tek’s not actually on the d-list?…
    by the way sf and ih, the part of the transaction not disclosed: i sold my soul so the yanks could get irod…

    dc July 30, 2008, 7:23 pm
  • DC: Thanks. I’ve asked Joba to throw at your head now.

    IronHorse (yf) July 30, 2008, 7:46 pm
  • SF: I don’t disagree with you here conceptually at all, but it’s interesting to me that in year’s past you have assailed Cash for a lack of “creativity.” The truth is it’s damn hard to be a gm; that’s something we’ve always agreed about.

    YF July 30, 2008, 9:25 pm

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