They’re Back (not Julio, though): Sox-Jays Gamer

Without Julio Lugo, Sox fans clearly have nothing to talk about… Not even Clay Buchholz’s 2009 debut, apparently. So far, he seems to be doing pretty good.
And Ortiz with the two-run double!!

Sad that I had to miss this game, but thrilled with the result. Buchholz for Halladay straight up? Yeah Toronto?

Have I mentioned before that the Sox signing Penny AND Smoltz made no sense?
Then again, Phearsome Phil shouldn’t be in the Yankee bullpen either. But at least the they didn’t sign Tom Glavine to keep Hughes at AAA.

Anyhow, if Buchholz continues to excel, who coul prove that his time in AAA wasn’t the reason he has grown as a pitcher?
Because he’s really not that different of a AAA pitcher than he was in 2008 (walks and hits are down, but so are Ks). The problem was getting out major league hitters, and that takes practice against major league hitters.
I have little doubt that Buchholz will struggle again in the majors. That’s what young pitchers do. But it’s better that than some old, and tired, retreads. I feel the same exact way about the Yanks.
Hey, no skin off my back. Buchholz is probably the third best starter in the organization. I’d much rather see Wakefield, Penny, or Smoltz in the playoffs and that’s what we’re likely to get.
Of course, it would be nice to if the Yanks could beat the Sox once during the season.

Because he’s really not that different of a AAA pitcher than he was in 2008 (walks and hits are down, but so are Ks).
By all accounts, this is not true. His confidence is better than it was when last he was in the majors, and he’s also done work on his delivery to regain command of his curveball.
Byt thanks, at least, for waiting longer than the two weeks you said you would after Penny shut down the Yankees before calling for his removal from the Red Sox.
But at least the they didn’t sign Tom Glavine to keep Hughes at AAA.
Smoltz is a far better pitcher than Glavine… and Andy Pettitte, whom the Yankees did re-sign, and is blocking Hughes from the rotation.

Rob, we’ve had this argument before, and every time you ignore the biggest difference: Buchholz’ biggest problem going into this season was fastball command. His command of that pitch has been mediocre, and when that happens it means batters can sit on his changeup and curve. He showed a HUGE improvement in AAA during the first month+ of the season, and his fastball command is now fantastic.
You can look at strictly the numbers all you want, but his fastball command (or lack thereof) was the sole reason he was held back in AAA this year. And it has become obvious that it was the right decision. Give it a f*cking rest dude, we’re all sick of having this argument.

I like your nickname for Buchholz, Devine. Took me a few weeks back in 2007 to correctly spell his name!
And yeah, I don’t see why Rob is so quick to try to make the Red Sox organization look bad for having too much pitching. If we didn’t have enough pitching and were forced to bring up Buchholz and Bowden at the start of the season (before they were ready), he would probably be lambasting the Sox for not having enough depth.
Pedroia singles, then Youk GIDP… except Pedroia does a great job of delaying the 2nd baseman, so now he’s at 2nd with Ortiz at the plate.

You say that and yet there has been little difference between his 2008 milb stats and those of 2009. Hard to see how “command” was an issue when his BB rate and K rate are almost identical. You’re entitled to your opinion. But you’re not entitled to you own facts.
I’m going off of what John Farrell said at the beginning of the season, and again a few weeks ago. So yeah, I trust his opinion a lot more than your biased speculation.

So a pitching coach is straightforward regarding a top prospect’s command of his #1 pitch, and you’re saying that’s unbiased? If a coach is going to be biased, he would be too positive about a player, as opposed to speaking frankly about the reason a player was held at AAA.
And you’re confusing overall command with fastball command. If Buchholz gets behind 2-0 in the count because he missed with his fastball location, and then throws a curveball for a strike that gets crushed over the fence, that’s not going to affect his K or BB rates. His hit rates have gone way down this year (7.4 H/9 at AAA compared to 6.1), so that seems to corroborate Farrell’s assessment.
It’s laughable that you think you know more than the man whose sole purpose is to determine whether or not a pitcher is ready. You’re entitled to your opinion, but yeah, I’ll trust Farrell’s assessment any day over your make-the-sox-look-bad jihad.

Also if Smoltz is not great, at least they can stick him in the pen (out goes Saito? Masterson demotion? really depends on how things go) and expect reasonable success.

Yeah, I’m all about “making the Sox look bad”. And conversely, I’m a complete homer for the Yankees. You got me.
As to your point(s), the pitching coach absolutely has to tell the kid he needs to work on something and that’s why he’s being sent down. Otherwise, he loses all credibility especially when the kid is in the top 3 of the organization’s major league starters. No, I don’t trust a pitching coach any more than I trust a manager. They say what they need to say and nothing more. As for the hits, you can’t look at them in isolation. The K rate is also down. That argues forcefully against improved command – fastball or otherwise.
Funny how you’ve ignored my question though. If the kid is “fixed”, why is he going back down again? And why did it take so long to find a start for him?

Even more irksome: after getting him up to 33 with none out in the second, the next 3 outs came on six pitches.
Still, he’s been in trouble early and that’s good news.

Betcha Toronto gets THEIR runner home from 3rd with none out.

Yeah, so, we’re going to have little to talk about if you take the pitching coach at his word. His obligation is to the organization, not truth. I really hope to see that conflict of interest.
And I really don’t care what players say. Francouer has been saying he’s hitting the ball well. If it doesn’t show up in the stats – which are nothing more than a collection of individual games – then it doesn’t exist to me. We can argue about the how well many things are measured, but “command” isn’t one of them.

That’s fine. Ignore the entirety of baseball history to take the pitching coach at his word (and H/9 in isolation). At least we know where your priorities lie.
Buchholz is still in AAA. That makes a ton of sense.