Winter Meetings Open Thread

Sources close to this blogger but who must remain anonymous because of their involvement in potential unconfirmed negotations have revealed that this might (or might not be) an open thread for discussion about what is happening (or not happening) at the MLB winter meetings.

38 comments… add one

  • Current news involves the Sox meeting with CC yesterday and the Sox in “talks” with the Mets about Brian Schneider as a catching option.
    http://www.newsday.com/sports/baseball/yankees/ny-spcc1209,0,6798672.story
    http://www.nj.com/mets/index.ssf/2008/12/mets_red_sox_talking_brian_sch.html

    SF December 9, 2008, 11:32 am
  • Sam, you misunderstand my desire to have a player “spurn the Yankees” – I just like the idea of a player bucking the norm with regards to these huge contracts is all.
    I could care less if CC goes to NY, and have said many times that I think that’s what is going to happen, and really, I kind of like the idea. However, I admire the idea that a player (like Maddux a few years back) leaving money on the table to play where he wants to play.
    You’re right, we have no idea what CC is thinking, and all we can go on is what we’ve heard, but to that extent, what we have heard is that he wants to play out west, so we are forced to go with that.
    I do not doubt at all that he is using the “west coast” idea to run the price up.
    Most likely, he’s just like all the others: he doesn’t really care what the uniform looks like at all, and as long as the checks keep coming, the decision is basically made.
    The next step is to leak a false offer from a west coast team to force NY to up their offer, which is going to happen, and it’s then that he’ll sign.
    My guess..for about 2 or 3MM a year more than the current Yankee offer.
    I have no desire for CC to use the Yankees at all, no matter how funny it will be to see a player NOT come to NY for huge dollars.
    Repost from below, didn’t realize there was an open thread..

    Brad December 9, 2008, 11:35 am
  • I’ll have a real problem if the Sox sign CC instead of Tex.

    Brad December 9, 2008, 11:36 am
  • Brad:
    What if they sign neither?!

    SF December 9, 2008, 11:43 am
  • I’d rather sign neither than sign CC.
    No real reason – I just think he’s going to be successful in Fenway, and I just don’t like him. I think he’s the horse that dies on the last lap every time.
    I’d rather they spend less on Burnett. Huge pitching contracts hardly ever work out.

    Brad December 9, 2008, 11:46 am
  • edit that: I think he’s going to NOT be successful in Fenway. As in – gets destroyed.

    Brad December 9, 2008, 11:59 am
  • For what its worth (not much):
    CC’s career in Fenway: 1-1, 24 IP, 2.35 ERA
    Brad, I find it interesting how little you think of one of the most dominant pitchers in baseball over the last few years. Time will tell I guess.

    Sam-YF December 9, 2008, 12:06 pm
  • Yeah, Sam: I agree.
    I have no good reason to not like him, I just don’t. He’s good for sure, but I just think that he’s being inflated by his stint in the NL this year. This year in Cleveland, he was average, and hitting the same stride as Beckett hit after his big year. I don’t think he’s a big time pitcher. And, by “big time” I mean playoffs, of course. I know the size is small, but it’s there nonetheless.

    Brad December 9, 2008, 12:14 pm
  • Brian Schneider? Ugh. Not exactly Salty, is it?
    Nick Cafardo says Carl Pavano’s agent has said the Red Sox have expressed interest in his client. Sounds like an agent trying to pump up the market more than anything, especially since he mentioned the Yankees also.
    Cafardo also said the Sox have shown interest in Brad Penny.
    http://www.boston.com/sports/baseball/redsox/extras/extra_bases/2008/12/a_few_things_he.html

    Paul SF December 9, 2008, 12:22 pm
  • Although Schneider does have a 106 sOPS+ against righties, while Varitek is career 111 versus lefties. Maybe a semiplatoon in which Schneider catches Wakefield?

    Paul SF December 9, 2008, 12:27 pm
  • How funny would it be for Pavano to be good in Boston.
    You couldn’t make that up.
    Fox radio said that Theo met with the Henricks brothers re: Pettitte.
    Imagine that?

    Brad December 9, 2008, 12:30 pm
  • Finally! Well I guess if you throw enough sh*t up at the wall, something is bound to stick sooner or later. I mentioned Schneider being a good fit for the Sox some time back. I have always been a big fan of his, I guess that’s about to end, LOL.

    John - YF December 9, 2008, 1:23 pm
  • notice that you-know-who’s name hasn’t come up at all? (Manny)

    dw (sf) December 9, 2008, 2:08 pm
  • From the Providence Journal:
    “The Red Sox and free-agent pitcher A.J. Burnett have had significant dialogue, and there could be more on this development later today.
    “Epstein, manager Terry Francona and pitching coach John Farrell reportedly met with CC Sabathia on Monday, but it’s Burnett who appears to be Boston’s main free-agent pitching target.”
    I wouldn’t be unhappy with a Burnett signing, but I wouldn’t be overjoyed either. Despite my devil’s-advocate attempts to defend him earlier this offseason, I remain decidedly ambivalent towards whether I’d want him on the Red Sox. I keep hearing concerns being raised about his makeup (as in poise, not blush).

    Paul SF December 9, 2008, 2:10 pm
  • from a unnamed source close to the negotiations, “Cashmans demands for CC to wear his cap appropriately and keep his jersey tucked in were not well received.”

    sf rod December 9, 2008, 2:57 pm
  • Personally, I’m hoping that the Nationals sign Manny. It would be a great move for that organization.
    The rumor is that K Rod and the Mets are close to getting that contract done.
    I, also, am of the belief that the Sabathia-not-wanting-to-play-for-the-Yankees is more of a media creation than anything. I’m sure he would prefer to stay on the West Coast and I’m sure that pitching against the 7,8,9 hitters in the National League piqued his interest in staying there, but I doubt that he just doesn’t want to go to the Yankees.

    walein December 9, 2008, 3:03 pm
  • Personally, I’m hoping that the Nationals sign Manny. It would be a great move for that organization.
    The rumor is that K Rod and the Mets are close to getting that contract done.
    I, also, am of the belief that the Sabathia-not-wanting-to-play-for-the-Yankees is more of a media creation than anything. I’m sure he would prefer to stay on the West Coast and I’m sure that pitching against the 7,8,9 hitters in the National League piqued his interest in staying there, but I doubt that he just doesn’t want to go to the Yankees.

    walein December 9, 2008, 3:03 pm
  • From ESPN:
    “Yankees general manager Brian Cashman and his front office team met late Monday night at the Bellagio with Darek Braunecker and Mark Rodgers, the agents for pitcher A.J. Burnett. The two sides plan to touch base again Tuesday.
    “Although the specifics of the Yankees’ offer to Burnett aren’t clear, it’s believed they’ve told the pitcher’s agents that they’re prepared to “do better” than the deal that Atlanta has on the table. The Braves have offered four years at $15 million a year, and the deal also includes a buyout provision and a fifth-year option.”
    So, if reports are to be belived, the Sox and Yanks are both in big on Burnett. Sounds like the Yanks are willing to offer either five years or more than $15m per year, in which case I’d say you can have him. Hard to imagine the Sox would be so interested in five years to a 32-year-old pitcher — but is that any worse than four years to a 35-year-old (Lowe)? Arguably not.

    Paul SF December 9, 2008, 3:11 pm
  • Hard to imagine the Sox would be so interested in five years to a 32-year-old pitcher — but is that any worse than four years to a 35-year-old (Lowe)? Arguably not.

    Is there an insurance issue? If so, Lowe may be more insurable than Burnett. So in fact, the four year deal to the 35 year old guy with no health issues may, in fact, be a better deal. And there’s also the “when you get the starts” factor. Are 110-120 starts from Burnett over 5 years worth more than 85-110 starts over 3 or 4 from Lowe for less money?

    SF December 9, 2008, 3:37 pm
  • Depends on the durability of Lowe, as well. I know he has a reputation as being extremely durable, but he’d be 39 at the end of a four-year deal. I’d be surprised if he didn’t start having problems in at least Year 3 of such a contract.

    Paul SF December 9, 2008, 3:47 pm
  • If Lowe is the better option, pass on everyone, and take your chances with Buchholz and Lowrie.
    Put the money towards Tex, please!

    Brad December 9, 2008, 3:54 pm
  • Though, I’d love to have Burnett.

    Brad December 9, 2008, 3:54 pm
  • I don’t believe this for an instant, but it’s interesting, from the San Jose Mercury News’ SF Giants beat writer’s blog:
    “UPDATE: An executive close to the CC Sabathia talks told me the perception is that the Brewers are emerging as the frontrunner.
    It’s been confirmed to me that the Giants had discussions with CC Sabathia’s camp last night, and they expect to have face-to-face meetings with the left-hander in San Francisco after the winter meetings.
    It sure must’ve have been a productive discussion, because word is that Sabathia has declined the Yankees’ six-year, $140 million offer. (I must stress that’s unconfirmed, but talk is spreading fast. If true, look for the Yanks to get hyper-aggressive on A.J. Burnett.)”

    Paul SF December 9, 2008, 5:12 pm
  • It’s been confirmed to me that the Giants had discussions with CC Sabathia’s camp last night, and they expect to have face-to-face meetings with the left-hander in San Francisco after the winter meetings.
    It sure must’ve have been a productive discussion, because word is that Sabathia has declined the Yankees’ six-year, $140 million offer. (I must stress that’s unconfirmed, but talk is spreading fast. If true, look for the Yanks to get hyper-aggressive on A.J. Burnett.)

    From the San Jose Mercury News. This is funny (or, if you will, lame), there’s no more source than the phrase “word is”. This is ridiculous reporting.

    SF December 9, 2008, 5:19 pm
  • One other thing: if this is even true, it doesn’t mean CC has rejected the Yankees, something the writer doesn’t seem to get. He’s only rejected the offer on the table. If he wants more money, that would seemingly be the right way to go – don’t take the offer!
    Again, I think this reporting is terrible, for the record.

    SF December 9, 2008, 5:21 pm
  • Cross-posted, Paul. Sorry about that. Typepad delays comments appearing and yours wasn’t there even when I put mine up.

    SF December 9, 2008, 5:23 pm
  • If he wants more money, that would seemingly be the right way to go – don’t take the offer!
    To critique myself, I am not sure that outright rejection of the Yankees’ offer, in the absence of a comparable alternative, would be the smartest move. But again we aren’t privy to anything, whether that is the specifics of the Yankees deal or any alternative that CC might have. We know nothing. Which is the point of pointing out the silliness of this weakly sourced rumor about “word” of a rejection of a Yankee offer.

    SF December 9, 2008, 5:33 pm
  • not surprisingly, this rumor has been shot down by a couple of people–Rosenthal and the people at ESPN. Seems the rejection is news to top Yankee executives.

    Nick-YF December 9, 2008, 5:37 pm
  • Yeah, it was terribly reported, no doubt.
    Speaking of terrible reporting, Tony Massarotti ran word of a Francoeur-for-Grienke trade this morning, and had it poo-pooed by other reporters before being rejected by Dayton Moore. Embarrassing… I wonder what it is that makes these people forget what journalism actually is. Well, I know the answer, but it’s still amazing.

    Paul SF December 9, 2008, 5:49 pm
  • From Perrotto:
    “There is a growing sense around the Bellagio that the Red Sox will land the top hitter on the free-agent market, first baseman Mark Teixeira. It’s unclear if they will agree to terms befor the winter meetings end Thursday.”

    Nick-YF December 9, 2008, 6:05 pm
  • Huge grain of salt. Other BP reporters have been notoriously wrong in the past, and Perrotto has come up with some whoppers today that have been immediately discredited.

    Paul SF December 9, 2008, 6:10 pm
  • “Other BP reporters have been notoriously wrong in the past”
    You’re being kind in not making that singular as in “Will Carroll has been notoriously wrong in the past.”:)

    Nick-YF December 9, 2008, 6:12 pm
  • “a growing sense”
    Is that a growing sense in your reporting or are you just happy to see me?
    I hate this kind of reporting. These guys will pretty much print anything just to scoop and drive traffic, get attention. Seriously, why not just ask a blue-haired old lady playing progressive slots where she thinks Sabathia will sign? 50 bucks she’ll have almost as much of an idea as these clowns with notepads.

    SF December 9, 2008, 6:13 pm
  • Part of what needs to be remembered is that teams serve their own best interest by seemingly being “in” on a big name free agent. This allows them to say to their fans, we tried but we simply got out bid by the richer team. The whole CC to the Giants thing is beyond unbelievable especially after their Zito debacle. As poorly run of a franchise as they are, they arent gonna be tying up about half of their payroll on two starting pitchers, especially when they actually have a decent staff beyond Zito, with a few of the games better young arms. The dodgers and the angels are both possible fits for him but the giants not so much.

    sam-YF December 9, 2008, 6:24 pm
  • Im getting a “growing sense” that SF is not pleased with the reporting from Vegas this winter….

    sam-YF December 9, 2008, 6:25 pm
  • http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/print?id=3758186&type=blogEntry
    Gammons says explicitly that CC “has an offer” from the Sox. I wonder how little it is for.

    SF December 9, 2008, 7:40 pm
  • Strange, too, that he says nothing has changed since last week. It’s Gammons, so I trust him pretty well, but that’s pretty remarkable that the Red Sox could have made any kind of offer to the biggest pitcher available this offseason and no one find out about it until now…

    Paul SF December 9, 2008, 9:13 pm
  • Maybe they offered him a cheeseburger.

    SF December 9, 2008, 9:42 pm

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