Hank lays down the law again!

It seems every two weeks, the Yanks present someone with an ultimatum. Today is no different! Hank Steinbrenner, who above all things is hilarious, lets the world know that he’s not joking…again:

The New York Yankees likely will pull
out of trade talks for Johan Santana if the Minnesota Twins don’t
make a decision by late Monday.

"I’m not going to be played against the Red Sox. That’s not
something I’ll do. That’s not something the Yankees should ever do,
and that’s I think what they’re trying to do now," Yankees senior
vice president Hank Steinbrenner said Sunday. "So if they want the
best offer that has been offered to them, then they need to make up
their minds."

It’s simple. I told you I loved you and the rest is bullsh*t! Either you believe me or I move on. (And there she left me, alone and cold on the Quad lawn. I listened to bad Emo the rest of the weekend in my dorm room, curled up in a ball.)

Hank being Hank doesn’t stop there. And the following quotation is the most interesting part of the article in my opinion:

"We’ll see how it goes, but this is not an act. It’s not a
bluff. It’s just reality," he said. "Because as much as I want
Santana, and you can make that clear — for his sake, to know that I
do want him
— but the fact is that I’m not going to play the game.
We’ve made them the best offer. And at this point, it’s not going
to get any better. So they can decide. At this point, it’s up to
them. I don’t think they want to lose us in this thing, obviously.
Nobody wants to lose the Yankees in a negotiation."
(Bold is mine)

Now this is what I want to know here. Is Hank sending Santana a subliminal message? Presumably Santana already knows that the Yanks and Sox want him. But is Hank The Great’s point, the fact that he wants Santana to know of the Yanks’ desire, to tell him that Hank will blow away any team with the extension he’d give to Santana? Is this tampering in any way? Is Hank telling Johan, Even if you’re traded to the Sox, you’d be wise to use that NTC?

Hank Steinbrenner just might be crazy like a fox. Or he might just talk a lot.

59 comments… add one
  • While it was a shrewd move on the part of Hank and Cashman to be so adamant about A-Rod only to get things going again when it was on their terms, this is a time when they have to stick to their guns.
    Hank is right. If the Yankees say, “See ya!”, then the Twins hand is that much weaker against the Red Sox. At that point, they’ll be lucky to get to Lester from the Sox.
    The Yankees have made the best offer. If the Twins don’t take it, screw em. Go with the kids and see what they can do.

    Jay-YF December 2, 2007, 10:09 pm
  • i don’t quite understand what the yankees gain from this. either the twins go for the deal which they most likely would have done later anyway or they don’t and the twins are left to negotiate with boston an no one else. At that point, the twins will be over the barrel hank will look like, dare I say, a bigger fool than he already looks like if he reenters the negotiations.
    I guess maybe he’s trying to force the red sox to commit more prospects by tomorrow but I think Hank is just proving himself to have even less sense than his old man. I guess that’s what happens in a monarchy. Why doesn’t he get a clue and let the guy who has acheived his place in the organization due to merit (cashman) take care of things. Hank is better off just sitting in the owner’s box and cheering.

    Jewish Jackhammer December 2, 2007, 10:24 pm
  • Or he wants the prospect of signing another $150+ contract over and done with before the winter meetings get full under way. I don’t think this is anything different than what normally happens when you have talkative owners that want people to identify them with the organization that they run.

    walein December 2, 2007, 10:27 pm
  • Well, he is three-for-three this off-season with his proclamations:
    1. A-Rod? Check.
    2. Jorge? Check.
    3. Mariano? Check.
    I agree, Nick, he’s exactly sending Johan a message. “You don’t get the money you deserve, we’ll be waiting.”
    The Yankees have made the best offer. There’s no need to delay things any longer.

    Mike YF December 2, 2007, 10:29 pm
  • How can anyone make a statement with such certainty about which team has made the best offer? None of us know anything like the truth, I imagine.

    SF December 2, 2007, 10:33 pm
  • Uh, I just did. And I do.
    Hughes + Melky + …
    I challenge any other team to match it!

    Mike YF December 2, 2007, 10:35 pm
  • P.s. I love Hank. He talks smack about his Dad. He talks smack about other teams. He talks smack about his own players. And in the middle of an interview he tells Tino not to worry about his place at Spring Training.
    I heart Hank. Long live the Steinbrenners!

    Mike YF December 2, 2007, 10:39 pm
  • Mike is right. Like I said in an earlier thread, I know that the Sox have said they’ll trade Ellsbury, but that’s it. No Lester or Buchholz at that point. So what they’re left with is Ellsbury (who like I said, while showing flashes of what he could be, still was ranked 46 places lower than Hughes) and two other players that haven’t even played at the big league level. Hughes and Melky have already proven they can play with the big boys. They’re both cheap and they’re both young.
    This a good move by Hank. He doesn’t want to jerk around any more than they have to, so put the screws to the Twins and see what Smith does.

    Jay-YF December 2, 2007, 10:43 pm
  • personally, I have no idea which team is offering the best offer. Say the rumored offers are true. Well, they are not so disparate in terms of the quality of prospect/players being offered. You might say that Hughes is the much higher ranked prospect among prospect mavens, but that means little if the Twins hold Ellsbury in higher regard. It also means little if the Twins view their depth at positional spots on the roster as a bigger issue than starting pitching.

    Nick-YF December 2, 2007, 10:47 pm
  • How can anyone make a statement with such certainty about which team has made the best offer? None of us know anything like the truth, I imagine.
    Posted by: SF | Sunday, December 02, 2007 at 10:33 PM
    Uh, I just did. And I do.
    Hughes + Melky + …
    I challenge any other team to match it!
    Well the answer lies with the Twins management. Either they settle for a top 10 prospect and a mid level CF talent or they opt for 4 top 10 prospects. Hell, Teixera garnered 6 of Atlanta’s top 10 prospects last year. And Mark won’t be cheap to sign come contract time. Bottom line….. Santana is a MUST for the Yanks and a luxury for the Bosox. Let Hank blather….. heck Percival turned him down to pitch for the D-Rays.

    Paul December 2, 2007, 10:50 pm
  • Troy Percival turning someone down says alot more good about you than bad.

    walein December 2, 2007, 10:54 pm
  • You might say that Hughes is the much higher ranked prospect among prospect mavens, but that means little if the Twins hold Ellsbury in higher regard.
    But it doesn’t make good business sense. Even if the Twins felt they had enough pitching that they felt better about Hughes than Ellsbury, Hughes alone would get them more if they decided to turn around and deal him as well.
    heck Percival turned him down to pitch for the D-Rays.
    Percival turned down the Yankees to close for the Rays.
    Big difference.

    Jay-YF December 2, 2007, 11:17 pm
  • I am getting the sense that Hank Steinbrenner has less maturity and baseball smarts as the average Yankee fan sitting next to me on a barstool in an upstate dive.
    I hope he keeps his promise this time. If he does, the Sox may wind up getting the bargain of the decade.

    Hudson December 2, 2007, 11:46 pm
  • Hudson-
    Read the interview in the NY Daily News today. Hank was traveling on the road and learning from the Yankee GMs (all of them) during his twenties. He might be the most knowledgeable baseball owner in the game. And if he’s not, I’d like to know who has more direct baseball experience, not simply owning a team. In that interview, he laments the loss of all the very good young pitching back then (Drabek, Rijo) because his Dad was impatient.
    And to be honest, I’d have no problem with Johan pitching at Fenway. Who’s the last left-handed pitcher to excel there? Bruce Hurst? For what, one season?

    Mike YF December 2, 2007, 11:58 pm
  • “You might say that Hughes is the much higher ranked prospect among prospect mavens, but that means little if the Twins hold Ellsbury in higher regard.”
    Joba Chamberlain was ranked…75th and Ellsbury 33rd Hughes 4rth….. and Dice-K #1 By Baseball America on March 1 2007. A season gone by and a #22 Garza yields a #3 Young in a trade and a #75 is kept over a #4 by the Yankee “Brain Trust”.
    “But it doesn’t make good business sense. Even if the Twins felt they had enough pitching that they felt better about Hughes than Ellsbury, Hughes alone would get them more if they decided to turn around and deal him as well.”
    If the offers were Hughes and Ellsbury alone, straight up for Santana, I might agree. However, it’s good business sense to evaluate the entire offer, as well as taking into account the risk of injury. Ellsbury came up big during crunch time (September and the Post Season). Hughes lost team time due to injury (self induced). The Sox deal includes a .300 hitting AAA SS and the #83rd ranked prospect. The NYYankee deal includes the statistical equivalent of Coco Crisp and a yet to be named mid-lower level prospect.
    We’ll soon all find out how the offers from both teams are
    evaluated by the Twins.
    heck Percival turned him down to pitch for the D-Rays.
    Percival turned down the Yankees to close for the Rays.
    Big difference.
    Big difference? At 38 I would have thought it’s about the money for Troy. Gauranteed $8M/2Y. But i guess it’s not closer money to a Yankee fan unless it’s double digit millions per year. Heck percival is signed for less per annum than Scott Linebrink. As a Sox Fan I’m thinking…. good for Troy…. bad for the Yanks.

    Paul December 3, 2007, 12:32 am
  • For the record, that’s not me.

    Paul SF December 3, 2007, 12:37 am
  • I don’t think Hank was saying that the Yankees had the “best offer.” I think he’s just stating that the Yanks have offered their best offer and either the Twins take it, or they leave it. The Twins obviously want this to last as long as possible, because the longer the process goes, the more time for the bidders to up their stakes.
    But Hank is in essence saying: Here. This is what we Offer. Take it or Leave it. I’m not getting involved in a bidding war. I’m not going to negotiate. I’m not going to play this out. I’m not going to let this cloud our organization any longer. This is our offer, this is our best offer, and we think its pretty good relative to the other offers you’ve heard. Take it or Leave it.
    In essence, they are doing the same that they did with A-Rod. They told him what they would be able to offer him, and told him either he take it, or he leave. And so he “left” and the Yankees re-commence only after he came back and said “i want to be the Yankees.”
    I think this is good for several reasons: I like transparency in ownership, even if its obnoxious. I like that the Yankees are refusing to get used against other teams. And I like that the Yankees are deciding internally what they are willing to give up, what the other team wants, and sticking to those declarations.
    If he could be a “nicer” guy, I might be happier, but I’d prefer bold and obnoxious over hedging and backtracking.

    Carlos December 3, 2007, 1:10 am
  • So i guess Ellsbury is a better prospect than Phil Hughes…Ellsbury’s Value after his playoff series will NEVER be higher than what it is now and yet people are saying that he’s a better prospect than Hughes?
    come on now..
    If that’s the case the i guess Minn thinks that Francisco (Max effort delivery) is going to stay healthy for the next 5-6 years as well….that chance of that happening is as likley as the Royals winning a W.S this decade.
    Ben Revere is only 2 years away from the Bigs and is EXACTLY the same kind of player as Ellsbury
    Be realistic…..Liriano isn’t going to stay healthy for a full season ESPECIALLY after T..J with his Max effort delivery.
    Robertson is 2-3 full seasons away.
    Perkins isn’t going to be the Ace of that staff anytime soon either

    Dj@-YF@yahoo.com December 3, 2007, 6:33 am
  • The Twins would be idiotic to value Ellsbury over Hughes. You can talk about their young pitching all you want, but Hughes has a higher upside than anyone they have not named Liriano.
    But, what matters is what Bill Smith values. And is he is stupid enough to value Ellsbury over Hughes, then there is not much the Yankees can do anyway. And if the Yankees pull out, the Sox will not be offering Ellsbury. It’s not a bad move by the Yankees. By making it public, they’re making it known that they mean it. The Twins decide today.

    AndrewYF December 3, 2007, 6:52 am
  • Thank God. I’m about sick of it, too, and I would have thought’d be impossible!

    Paul SF December 3, 2007, 8:05 am
  • is he is stupid enough to value Ellsbury over Hughes
    There is likely a package of players. It will be up to Smith to decide which package is better. The best package may not include the best player in the deal — this sometimes happens. It may not happen with Santana, but it is not unprecedented for a GM to choose a bigger package of players over the one with the most highly regarded prospect.

    SF December 3, 2007, 8:14 am
  • it feels to me like the twins have over played their hand on Johan. The Sox and the Yankees are both sick (rightfully) at this point of being played off each other. Its OK to do for a bit but at this point its been the better part of a week and fatigue is certainly setting in. It also seems that the teams value a trade for him more or less in the same terms. This is short of what the Twins want but that falls squarely in the column of tough sh**. If they arent happy they should walk away. If they need to trade him time to put up. They cant hold the sox and yankees hostage for the entire winter meetings while there is other business to be done. I think Hank is simply saying what everybody from both organizations feels and if it forces resolution Im happy about it.

    sam-YF December 3, 2007, 8:32 am
  • http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/front/5347088.html
    Pettitte will play for the Yankees in 2008. Johan or not, things are looking a heck of a lot brighter in Yankeeland today.

    Anonymous December 3, 2007, 8:36 am
  • ^ me. Also, any posts by AndrewYF are also me. I post from several computers, and Typepad is wacky sometimes.

    Andrew December 3, 2007, 8:40 am
  • thank you Andy. Now if the Twins would just decide for us….

    sam-YF December 3, 2007, 8:41 am
  • Hank uses the first person a lot when referring to the Yankees. “I” won’t do this, “I do want him”, etc. Don’t a bunch of people own the team? Doesn’t he act in the interest of an organization?
    This is pretty telling about his personality, I think.

    SF December 3, 2007, 9:01 am
  • I have a huge amount of respect for Hank for not wanting to bullshit around anymore. Because that’s what this Sox-Yanks cold war is: bullshit. But if the Twins don’t bite, and the Yankees pull out, I’ll be happy because the Red Sox will probably land Santana, and maybe even without Ellsbury.
    Like Hank, I just want this Santana-orgy to end.

    Atheose December 3, 2007, 9:05 am
  • I think its pretty clear that the Twins will walk away from both teams if they arent getting what they want. The yankees pulling out doesnt mean the sox would get Johan for a bag of balls (or just lester)

    sam-YF December 3, 2007, 9:08 am
  • I agree Sam, but if the Yanks are out of the mix then I think the Sox backpedal to their offer of Lester-Crisp-Lowrie-Masterson. With Hughes-Melky off the table that then becomes the strongest offer, unless the Angels or Dodgers decide to get crazy.

    Atheose December 3, 2007, 9:12 am
  • That may be the strongest package left but if they havent taken it by now why would they later? They would sooner take the Ellsbury package or the Hughes package now. They know what the deadline is and will pick from the best offers not the secondary offers. You can toss the LA teams out too, Johan has said he will only waive his NTC for the yanks and the sox. The screws are being turned on the Twins from multiple angles.

    sam-YF December 3, 2007, 9:17 am
  • That may be the strongest package left but if they havent taken it by now why would they later?
    Because they knew they could play the two teams off of one another to up the ante. If I am willing to sell my car for $5,000, but two people get into a bidding war and drive the price up, and then one person backs out, what’s to stop the other person from going back to the original offer? Since I was originally aiming for that $5,000 price I would take it, even if I am somewhat disappointed for not getting more with both parties involved.

    Atheose December 3, 2007, 9:22 am
  • Sounds like wishful thinking to me. They dont need to sell, thats the point. I dont think they would spend all of this time driving up the price only to let it walk out the door and take a smaller price. If they did, there would be uproar in their fanbase and If i were the twins owner id fire the GM.

    sam-YF December 3, 2007, 9:25 am
  • For the record, I don’t believe that the original offer made by the Sox is good enough to get Santana, but i DO believe that it’s a posibility. It all depends on how much the Twins want to get rid of him. They’ll get less if they want until the trade deadline.

    Atheose December 3, 2007, 9:26 am
  • They dont need to sell, thats the point.
    If they want to get the most for Santana, then they do need to sell. They’ll get a lot less for him at the trade deadline, and if they keep him all season and he becomes a free agent then the Twins get nothing.

    Atheose December 3, 2007, 9:28 am
  • For starters, they would get 2 first round draft picks if he leaves via free agency, thats not nothing. Joba Chaberlain and IPK are the products of such picks received when Tom Gordon signed with the Phils. In addition, they would get another year of Johan and be able to make a run this season. If they decide they NEED to sell, why wouldnt they take the offers at their apex?
    Also, Johan said he wont waive his NTC during the season, so that may not be a possibility either.

    sam-YF December 3, 2007, 9:32 am
  • I just really wish everyone (Hank, Johan, etc) would shut the f**k up and concentrate on business at hand. There’s waaaay too much chirping coming in from all sides.
    Do Twins lose some of their leverage now that Pettitte says he’ll be back? I would think so. I also hope this finally causes the trade to fall through. The longer this circus drags out, the worse feeling I get about it.

    yankeemonkey December 3, 2007, 9:41 am
  • It matters very little what Hank says anyhow. In the last thirty days alone, he’s shown us that no matter what he says, the door is always open to negotiation. I would imagine that the Twins are thinking that he said they wouldn’t sign A-Rod without the Texas money, and did. They wouldn’t up the ante on Mo, and did.
    He’s shown that he’s very capable of not standing by his word a few times now. Why think this time is any different?
    Smartest owners in baseball? Based on exactly what? How smart do you have to be to lose the Texas money, still give away +300million to a third baseman, make one near forty closer the richest reliever in the game, and offer a four year deal to a near forty catcher? Granted, they’re all good moves, but hardly has he garnished the “smartest owner in the game” title in the last month.
    Jeez, calm down. He’s done absolutely NOTHING to make the team any better than it was last year, and in fact, they’re worse.

    Brad December 3, 2007, 9:50 am
  • edit that: Petttitte is back (I’ve been away), so they’re exactly where they were. Not worse.

    Brad December 3, 2007, 9:53 am
  • They are exactly the same? How about the 3 young pitchers who werent on the team for the majority of the year last year?

    sam-YF December 3, 2007, 9:55 am
  • He’s done absolutely NOTHING to make the team any better than it was last year, and in fact, they’re worse.
    They’re better with ARod, and they’re better with Posada. Hughes/Chamberlain/Kennedy need that veteran catcher, and the four years buys Hank time to find a replacement.
    I would say the team is worse off than it was before.

    Atheose December 3, 2007, 9:55 am
  • Carlos –
    If you read that profile I keep pimping, Hank is exactly aiming for that transparency. He thinks the fans deserve it and I agree. After all, had he not come public with the deadline, we’d all be in the dark today.
    Great news on Pettitte! Now Santana is nice, but I’m happy either and any way. Yanks get him = cool, we have the best pitcher in the game. Sox get him = let them give up their prospects and their cash for a lefty in Fenway. Twins keep him = cool, we get him after the year for only cash.

    Mike YF December 3, 2007, 9:55 am
  • I meant to say “I WOULDN’T say the team is worse”. My mistake.

    Atheose December 3, 2007, 9:55 am
  • Yeah, I don’t think they’re worse, but at what position have they gotten better for sure?
    The three rookie pitchers may be good and end up better than last year, but then again they’re rookies.
    I was trying to say that they’ve maintained their level, but hardly improved anywhere.
    They may get better pitching, but then again, they may not.

    Brad December 3, 2007, 10:01 am
  • Sox get him = let them give up their prospects and their cash for a lefty in Fenway.
    So, if the Yankees get him, he’s the “best pitcher in baseball”, but if the Sox get him, he’s just another “lefty in Fenway”?
    Seems sensible to me.

    Brad December 3, 2007, 10:02 am
  • Brad,
    In working directly with GMs for years during the 80’s, I’d say Hank’s most in tune with the baseball operations, and talent evaluation, of any owner out there. Unless you have another in mind?
    At least we know Sox fans around here, top to bottom, are consistent with the “A-Rod got 300+ million” meme. Too bad it’s not true. He took a pay cut, as much as you want to believe otherwise.
    They didn’t ante up on Mo. He wanted four years. He got three.
    Geez, but now you’re reduced to arguing about money and the Yankees? Heh.

    Mike YF December 3, 2007, 10:05 am
  • Yeah, Brad, look at the histories of lefties in Yankee Stadium versus in Fenway.
    Besides, the Sox are less stocked at the upper levels of their farm because they keep trading away talent. I’m cool if they do it again.
    The Sox might need Santana less. But they can’t afford him as well. If they pull the trigger, I’m not going to call the season finished – not by a long shot.

    MIke YF December 3, 2007, 10:14 am
  • Brad if giving at 38 year old Rivera $14 mil is a mistake then I guess you’d agree that paying a 41 year old Curt Schilling $14 mil is a mistake too?

    sam-YF December 3, 2007, 10:14 am
  • Yes, I would. I’m not biased either way when it comes to that. It’s was not a good move on their part.

    Brad December 3, 2007, 10:36 am
  • Hank the Tank! Hank the Tank!!

    Devine December 3, 2007, 11:06 am
  • anybody out there still think there’s not a hefty amount of yankee/hank-bashing going on?…sf and i debated that topic at length yesterday…in the meantime, say one bad thing about the sox mgmt/ownership team, and many sox fans come unglued…why do you insist on making personal attacks on yankee ownership?…it gets in the way of a truly objective assessment of the actions and performance of the individual…that’s what we should be discussing…yes hank’s a bit blustery [DNA], but i believe he has more hands on baseball knowledge and is less impulsive than his dad…he should be given the benefit of the doubt at this point…isn’t that what you guys wanted for the new sox ownership and theo, the benefit of the doubt?…if a yank fan said he hated theo, called him names, and questioned every move and thing he said, you guys would get all defensive on him…how ’bout a little decorum?…some of it is funny, if a bit tedious…
    no, we [the yanks] don’t have the smartest ownership/mgmt in baseball, and perhaps neither do you…not sure how one goes about measuring that anyway…both teams’ resumes are littered with questionable or downright bad moves…pavano’s one i hear about all the time…remember, he would have been calling out sick at fenway, except at the last minute he decided he’d rather “not play” for the yankees…we also apparently both wanted gagne…do i need to go on?…let’s just say winning makes one look like less of an idiot…
    note to sox fans: you haven’t lost out on santana yet, and you may not, so there’s no reason to start the spin machine just yet…if the yanks prevail, there’ll be plenty of time to critique the trade, the negotiators’ performances, the amount of money offered to santana, the impact on competitive balance…i’ll be shocked if most of you sox fans don’t give the yanks low scores on all counts…all you need to do is alter the facts a bit, then spin the s*** out of it…
    i applaud mike and sam for continuing to show such patience while correcting the record for the more revisionist sox fans around here…you really don’t believe the stuff you said in your earlier comments do you brad?…come on man, you’re better than that, and usually more objective…don’t let your dislike for the yankees and yankee-hank to cloud your understanding of the facts [thanks again mike]…

    dc December 3, 2007, 12:19 pm
  • dc, I do believe Brad is very anti-Yankees organization, but I don’t think the rest of us are. In fact, in my post at 9:55 I’m DEFENDING the Yankees moves.
    Don’t let one person (Brad) make you think ALL Sox Fans are bashing the Yankees.

    Atheose December 3, 2007, 12:26 pm
  • Wait, didn’t I say the moves were good ones? I didn’t say they were bad. What are you talking about, dc? How smart does a guy have to be to do what he’s done? It’s not bashing at all.
    And yes, I am very, very Anti-Yankee, but that doesn’t mean that I’ve never offered praise where it was deserved, because I have.
    At what point did I say anything that wasn’t true, dc?

    Brad December 3, 2007, 12:53 pm
  • Plus, when I realized that Pettitte was back, I took back the “they’re worse off” comment, right? What else is it that causes you to say I’m bashing? In fact, I said Schilling was a mistake when asked about it with regards to Mo’s contract.

    Brad December 3, 2007, 12:56 pm
  • http://www.startribune.com/blogs/neal/?p=282
    I’d like to point out that I’m a freaking genius or something! The Twins are angry at Hank for potentially tampering:
    http://www.startribune.com/blogs/neal/?p=282
    Apparently, the subtle message wasn’t too subtle.

    Nick-YF December 3, 2007, 3:21 pm
  • As much as I hate to state that there is a double-standard when it comes to Yankee organization, there is.
    Offering a $14 million contract to a 41 year old closer is a big deal and possibly a disastrous use of funds…for any team besides the Yankees.
    Why? Cause the Yankees have committed to a payroll of what, over $200 million we say? Last year it was $195 million. I think Pavano is coming off the books, so now its $185 million. Posada signed for $1 million more than he made last year. Mariano signed for $4 million more than he made last year.
    Lets say some other things shape up, and the Yankee salary for 2008 is in the neighborhood of $220-$240 million dollars. Our closer suddenly is 6% of our total payroll.
    Factor in the new stadium, the growing YES network and the Yankees are flushed with cash. Hank isn’t cutting payroll and then making a huge investment in one player. In the new Yankee payscale Mo is still making less than Giambi, Jeter, A-Rod, Abreu, Posada and Santana(hypothetically.) He’s making about the same money as Mussina and Matsui.
    This is not to say that the Mo move was a “good” move. You have to look at whether you believe he remains dominant or whether he’s washed up. You have to look at the stagnancy it could create. You have to weight the emotional value of Mo back there against the reality of being an old overworked closer. But pointing at the salary implies that $14 million is a big deal for the Yankees.
    And its not. For a team working on $100, its over 10% of your salary. Thats alot invested in one part of your 25-man roster.
    But when you are fielding a $220 million ballclub, $14 million is just another player. And Hank and his brother and the rest of the Yankee organization have crunched the numbers. They know how much money they can spend and remain profitable, and $14 million a year won’t change that.

    Carlos (YF) December 3, 2007, 3:23 pm
  • My dream scenario is the Twins are so mad, they decide to take the Sox’ offer.
    It could happen, right? Right??

    Paul SF December 3, 2007, 3:24 pm
  • This is a really good point Carlos. The Yankees make alot of money so it stands within reason that their players should too. They are getting about the same cut of the pie that others might be getting just from a much much larger pie. The Sox “pie” is rather large too, their guys get a nice slice themselves to push the metaphor a bit further.

    sam-YF December 3, 2007, 3:30 pm
  • I forgot to factor in the luxury tax. Preliminary research says that in 2005, they exceeded the payroll threshold for the third time under the labor contract that began after the 2002 season. This meant that the Yankees were taxed at a 40 percent rate on the amount above $128 million. They paid $35 million since they had a salary of $213 million that year.
    So, they will definitely be above $200 this year, and this would be the 5th time they exceeded the threshhold. Does anyone know what the tax rate would be for the Yankees this year?
    So, even as we boggle at the numbers the Yankees are throwing out at these players, we also need to be aware (as assuredly they are) that this number is misleading. The Yankees are paying ALOT more than just the salary amount for these players. They are paying the salary + the luxury tax.
    It goes to show that the Yankees (and the Red Sox are only $50 million behind) are working on a different scale of gain/loss.

    Carlos (YF) December 3, 2007, 3:31 pm
  • athose, my comment was not meant for you, since i don’t recall seeing any evidence of you making personal attacks on the ownership, or skewing the facts for the convenience of making an argument…my comments were intended for brad, hudson, sf, and the “non-sf” iteration of paul in this thread…all they can say is hank made a good move by signing arod [can’t criticize retaining the best player in baseball, and a player that the sox still covet], but they didn’t like the way he accomplished it…huh?…arod’s going to get less guaranteed money than he asked for, in fact less per year than he makes now, but the yanks overpaid…huh?…so now hank’s word is no good because he beat boras at his own game…rumor is that the sox have now decided to include ellsbury in the offer for santana after previously declaring he was off-limits…now i could make some statement about how the sox word is no good, but my understanding of the FACTS is that the sox actual position was not to offer ells unless they had to, hoping the twins would bite on coco/lester plus prospects, rather than an offer of ells [no lester] plus prospects…or i could use the same math logic as the sox fans and say you paid $57m plus incentives and perks to have dice-k pitch this year…like brad claims, what did i say that wasn’t true in that statement, other than leave out some important context?…how can i think anything but this criticism of the yankees is revisionist, baseless, and blatantly biased…it’s becoming personal: the words may be different, but what i’m hearing is that hank has made good moves, but he pays too much, and his word is no good [there’s worse if you go back and read the previous threads]…based on what evidence exactly?…mike and i have already blown a million holes in the arod argument, so i need something else…i’d say give the guy a few years, like you wanted for henry and theo, then you can better assess if he’s got the right idea for the yankees…without actually knowing the man, they want to assess the man’s character and his performance based on his first few decisions…now that’s a small sample size… you know, the more i hear about the sox losing out on arod, again, for the second time, the more i realize the grapes must be real sour up in mass…not on the same level as theo busting up a hotel room over losing jose contreras, but the level of angst is similar…like i said, there’s plenty of jokes we can make about both of our teams, and some of it is funny, just tedious when it’s repeated over and over and over…i smell red sox fear frankly…

    dc December 3, 2007, 3:41 pm

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