If it Looks Like a Duck…

"A-Rod (ticks) everybody off, because there’s a lot of jealously involved," Torre said. "He makes the game look so easy, he plays very hard, and it’s something he has to live with."

Having pissed off another team with his questionable on-field interfering tactics (what is it with this guy?!), Joe Torre attributes the animosity sent towards the Anti-Jeter to his hydrocephalus and ego "talents".  Which makes us wonder: why don’t players hate Johan Santana?  Or Mariano RIvera? Or Derek Jeter? Or Manny? Or Big Papi? Or Greg Maddux? Or (before he got hurt) Jim Thome? Or Mike Piazza? Or…well, I think we all get the point. So why do people, not just obsessed Red Sox fans, think A-Rod is an a**hole?  Joe Torre is clearly not familiar with the theory of Occam’s Razor.

38 comments… add one
  • SF, an awfully long time between posts about A-Rod! I’m sorry to see you’re off the wagon again.

    Nick August 22, 2005, 11:02 am
  • Come on, SF, get over it. The slap is in the past, and it’s not as if it’s the most egregious form of “cheating” in big league history.
    The reason why most people hate people A-Rod is that he’s the highest paid player in the history team sports worldwide, and he also happens to be almost supernaturally talented. It’s jealousy, pure and simple. I guarantee that if he’d joined the Sox, you’d have no problem embracing him. Fans always hate the players that they secretly most wish was on their team.
    And, really, are you suggesting that A-Rod is the only pro athelete with an ego? Get off his case, man. He’s quite possibly the most naturally gifted ball player of all time, he works hard, always hustles, and has maintained incredibly high standards for almost a decade. How many players can say that?

    Sam August 22, 2005, 1:13 pm
  • I am not suggesting A-Rod is the only guy with an ego (hell, Big Papi has one, I am sure of it, and I know Manny’s got one). I am not suggesting A-Rod doesn’t try hard. I am not suggesting that A-Rod isn’t insanely talented. I am not suggesting that I wouldn’t root for him if he played for the Sox. I am not suggesting any of those things you mention. The only thing I am suggesting is that Occam’s Razor offers us the best answer to the question “why does everyone think A-Rod is an a**hole”.
    If you think it’s because he’s highly paid and highly talented, and guys are jealous (ha!) when the whole league is filled with guys who are supremely talented and paid ridiculous sums (Tejada, Vladi can get added to the list of massively talented guys with GI-normous contracts) who aren’t considered a-holes, then you live in a world where twisted and faith-based logic trumps simplicity. You’ve got to be a Republican.

    SF August 22, 2005, 1:26 pm
  • Gee, How come I don’t remember that much AROD bashing before he started playing for the Yankees. I swear I recall Sox fan’s eager anticipation for AROD before the Player’s Union kiboshed the deal. Smacks of hypocrisy.

    Bozo the Homey August 22, 2005, 1:34 pm
  • Maybe I can put it more simply, with an analagous deployment of Occam’s Razor:
    Why did Courtney Love appear to be heavily drugged at the Pamela Anderson roast last week? Was it because “someone must have put sudafed in her bottle of Evian when she was backstage, graciously giving an interview to a correspondent from E!, all the while turned away from the table on which her bottle rested, at which point Yasmine Bleeth, who had a head cold, accidentally put the sudafed in the bottle thinking it was hers, but after Courtney’s interview was done she grabbed the misidentified bottle and sipped said sullied water, thus causing the Hole frontwoman to act a bit tired throughout the evening’s festivities?” Or was it because Courtney Love knowingly took drugs?
    Or, in baseball terms: “why did Raffy Palmeiro test positive for Stenozol?” and “why do people think A-Rod is a d**ck?”
    The simple answer, Sam. The simple answer.

    SF August 22, 2005, 1:37 pm
  • Okay, how’s this: why do other players not like A-Rod? Because in a league full of insanely talented and ridiculously rich young men, all of whom have huge – and sensitive – egos and think they’re the Alpha Dog, he’s the most talented, the richest, and is still relatively young. They all know this and resent him for it.
    The simple answer.

    Sam August 22, 2005, 1:43 pm
  • We’re missing the point here–who the hell cares if A-Rod is an asshole or not? We’re not watching these guys to determine which is fit to babysit our kids! I like the fact that he’s an arrogant SOB who pushes the limits of baseball’s selectively-enforced rules. Part of the game is forcing the umps to make calls on plays that are hard to call. I’m a Yankees fan, and dammit if that slap play worked I would have been thrilled, Rodriguez just made it way too obvious for the umps to have a tough time calling it; had a Sox player done the same, I would have mocked him furiously, just like SF and his unwashed minions do to A-Hole now.
    Besides, if we want to have an asshole contest, the Sox are surely the undisputed champions! Manny? Schilling? Millar? Foulke? If you think these guys aren’t hated, get real. Not that you should care, of course.

    tom yf August 22, 2005, 1:49 pm
  • Hey, it’s not that hard to root for a guy who is an a** and also admit that he is an a**. I think lifelong YF-Spidey is firmly in that camp w/r/t A-Rod. Instead, we are treated to numerous Yankees fans and a Yankees manager coming up with harebrained explanations for why people don’t like one of their players. This ought to show us just how insecure A-Rod is, in fact. It was never hard for Yankees fans to root for Boomer Wells (and now we have to do it too), while simultaneously acknowledging that the guy is a donkey’s rearend.
    (I have to admit that part of the fun of starting a thread like this is watching Yankees fans spin themselves into a web of confused logic)
    In the interest of full disclosure: There are plenty of Red Sox dingleberries, guys who would have gotten about a 2 on the “teammate likeability” scale that I have rooted for in the past, including Mike Greenwell and Wade Boggs. On the Bruins I used to root for Ken Linseman (the “Rat”, one of the diritest, cheapest players in the history of the NHL and a totally despicable character on the ice – I once saw him spear an opposing player in the ‘nads, off the puck, after surveying the referee’s position to see if he was looking). What can you do? Rooting for a player you hate is fine – it’s not hypocritical. It’s part of the deal. If you are lucky, you don’t have to do it too often.
    More full disclosure: I actually enjoy watching A-Rod play the game, regardless of his uniform, and he’s one of several guys I would pay to see, no matter who he played for.

    SF August 22, 2005, 1:50 pm
  • I’m not going to deny A-Rod’s assholishness. Where there’s smoke there’s fire. Apparently, a lot of his peers do not like him. Whatever. It’s not the worst thing in the world to be disliked by a lot of jocks. In fact, often, it’s a badge of honor. Think Jim Bouton. Mike Mussina (a Democrat, by the way) has often been viewed as tough to get along with. From what I’ve heard him say, he strikes me as a reasonable and decent person. Now, as far as I can tell, I’d probably wouldn’t like A-Rod on a personal level. This is all based on the fact that he plays Linkin Park before each at bat. That’s weak. And I admit that’s a shallow reason to dislike a guy, but, let’s be honest, there are certain world views represented in the music one likes. Ok, I’m not being serious, but, maybe, I am. My point. I don’t have a point.
    Oh yeah. Who the F cares about whether A-Rod is disliked by a lot of players. Sox fans obviously hate him more than other team’s fans (oh, that’s right, excepting Mariners fans). And they say all kinds of stupid shit about him. Example, for some reason, some fans in RSN are obsessed by his apparent purple lips. Some of them think this means he puts lipstick on and he kisses boys. The nickname has that effect, too. A-Rod rhymes with Gay-Rod. I was reminded of this in a bar in Cambridge once. Still, I’m not sure this is a cogent point. Anyway, the point is that he’s probably the best player I’ve seen in a Yanks uniform. Not my favorite but Yanks fans are lucky to be able to witness how effortless he makes everything seem. If you look at the team’s offensive numbers for the past month, he’s basically carrying the team. He’s had an unbelievable MVP season.
    Well, that had no point.

    Nick August 22, 2005, 1:50 pm
  • Well, thanks for the nod, SF. I do root for ARod, and I do think his head is bigger than the big bat outside the Stadium. The news that he chose Linkin Park as his at-bat tune only makes me loathe him more (what is he, twelve?). But I’ll root for him to hit a dinger after the Linkin Park is over. I don’t know. As a Broncos fan, I was trained in this schizo sort of fandom when Romo was on the team. I mean, there you had a guy who was maybe the biggest prick in all of sports, and possibly in the history of the earth, but I cheered every time he made a key tackle to stop a running back short of the first-down marker. (When he finally [and appropriately] got traded to the Raiders, he became P.E. #1.) Anyway, having guys like ARod and Sheff and KB on the team just make me appreciate the Brosius/Paulie/Conie Yanks squads more than ever. Those teams had none of these issues of ‘jealousy’ or ‘who’s the man.’ And, of course, note the differing results.

    Spidey August 22, 2005, 3:12 pm
  • It had a point, as far as a fan is concerned what do you find it easier to root for a player hated by other team and their fans, who works hard and produces. Or a player which other teams and their fans have no strong feelings for but produces and is feared, yet he often is lazy, asks out of games, and doesn’t really care about anything. Who would you rather have AROD or Manny? I don’t think you can claim one is better than the other as a hitter, yet they play the game totally differently. Who would you want to give your $20 million to?
    All that being said, the Sox fans don’t like Alex Rodriguez, WGAS?

    Bozo the Homey August 22, 2005, 3:37 pm
  • I think everything that has been said has some form of truth to it, but different fan bases try to twist the argument so they appeared to be represented the best. It is true that Alex Rodriguez is the highest paid player in baseball, and can be argued to be the best player in baseball. Jealousy definitely plays a part in the aminosity directed towards A-Rod. People see something the desperately wish they could be, wrapped up with polished post-game conferences and fine suits, and they become jealous. A-Rod appears so outwardly perfect that people (especially those rooting against him) will try to find – and overstate – any fault in him they can, simply because they don’t believe he is as perfect as he seems. But aside from jealousy, there are other good arguments people can make for not liking A-Rod. It could be coincidence that when he left Seattle they won 116 games, or that when he left Texas they improved by close to 10 games, but that seems unlikely. It seems illogical that the Yankees, by adding one of the best players of all time, would not win as many games as the ’98 Yankees, and would not finish off a 3-0 postseason lead. The only (seeming) explanation is that A-Rod brings a negative presence to the clubhouse, because he certainly performs once on the field (another could be he doesn’t perform when under pressure, but I doubt that). He is also very honest about his abilities. He knows he is a great player, and does not pretend otherwise. Such forthrightness also has a tendency to irk people. But whether the low public opinion of him is based more in jealousy than truth, I do not know, but it is certainly based somewhat in both.

    David August 22, 2005, 4:36 pm
  • David, take your non-biased attitude and git. Don’t you realize where your posting? Pick a side and don’t give us any more common sense ;-)

    Bozo the Homey August 22, 2005, 6:55 pm
  • Alrighty, A-Rod sucks

    David August 22, 2005, 7:30 pm
  • All time favorite footaball team for this Sox fan…THE Denver Broncos.
    Nice to see we have at least one small thing in common, Spidey.
    Ah, the days of Atwater, Smith, and Mecklenburg. How I miss the three Amigos.

    brad-sf August 22, 2005, 7:40 pm
  • There are plenty of unlikeable players in the MLB who don’t make childish, lame, unsportsmanlike, and colossally stupid moves like trying to slap the ball out of someone’s mitt during a League Championship game before an audience of millions.
    So IMHO, A-Rod is in a class of his own as far as being an a-h0le.

    Hudson August 22, 2005, 7:40 pm
  • For fans of great football players, I’m aware of who the three Amigos are, I just worded that wrong.

    brad-sf August 22, 2005, 7:41 pm
  • Wow, you Sox fans are really obsessed with the ‘slap play’. Get over it. At this point you sound more childish than what you make the play out to be.

    Bi-partisan Judge August 22, 2005, 8:50 pm
  • I know I speak for myself when saying that I don’t like A-Rod (Slappy McBluelips)purely because of the beginning of the season in 2004. Yes, RSN was disappointed that they didn’t acquire him last year. That disappointed lead to absolute joy when he was like 0 and 30 at bat (or something like that). So after that he was just put under the microscrope and totally picked apart for every stupid thing he did!
    Don’t get me wrong, RS has their fair share of a**holes. Foulke gets my vote after listening to him on WEEI on numerous occassions.

    JennyO August 23, 2005, 8:31 am
  • This A-Rod the A-hole talk is out of date. The combination of his marriage and the shrink he’s been going to have calmed him, changed him, and taken most of the a-hole out of him.
    He used to have one of the greatest cases of insecurity since Reggie. Like Reggie, he had to constantly promote himself. And around confident players like Captain Jeter he felt awkward and consequently looked awkward.
    This year he is a lot more confident and relaxed. It probably also helps that Sheff gives him pep talks. I don’t see a-holes like Schilling talking about him anymore.
    All the Slappy McBluelips stuff says more about some parts of the Nation than A-Rod. Who else but Sox fans talks about it?

    john yf August 23, 2005, 8:43 am
  • John, I agree with you. However, I don’t see any reason why Yankees fans should be defending A-rod from Sox fans. What else do we expect than absolutely senseless mind-numbing junk (like “Slappy McBluelips”) from most Sox fans? Keep up with $hit like “Slappy McBluelips” and you’re only showing us who the real a-hole is. Enough is enough.

    Get.Over.It August 23, 2005, 9:10 am
  • hey, if you slap balls, interfere on the regular, and fail to hit the ball out of the infield during a crucial four game stretch when your team need your big 25million dollar bat to show up….there is a good chance it’ll be noticed.
    John, wasn’t it Schilling who told the world that A-Rod may be the most talented man to ever play baseball, and that his talents were “a freak of nature”?
    How much bigger a compliment do you want him to give the guy?
    But you’re probably right, it has to be solely the Red Sox fans that put this guy in the unlikeable spotlight he’s always in – no matter what city he’s in. In fact, don’t I recall a little bit of a rough stretch right in his home NY where the booing was Beltran-esque no matter what the guy did?
    We’re all A-Holes for A-Rod!
    That’s my best Sterling. Funny if you think about it.

    brad-sf August 23, 2005, 9:37 am
  • “In fact, don’t I recall a little bit of a rough stretch right in his home NY where the booing was Beltran-esque no matter what the guy did?”
    Really? Like even when he hit homeruns? And made good plays in the field? That doesn’t make any sense. I think you’re making that up.

    Nick August 23, 2005, 10:09 am
  • This is really such a bunch of crap. Name the last good Yankee player, even a stud and all-around decent guy like Mo (AKA in RSN as “Fruitbat”) that Sox fans didn’t denigrate and insult. You would think it would calm down after they won the WS, seems the hate is just too ingrained.
    Once again Sox fans seek help.

    Bozo the Homey August 23, 2005, 10:36 am
  • Are we really being told to seek help by Bozo the Homey?

    brad-sf August 23, 2005, 10:40 am
  • This is really such a bunch of crap. Name the last good Yankee player, even a stud and all-around decent guy like Mo (AKA in RSN as “Fruitbat”) that Sox fans didn’t denigrate and insult. You would think it would calm down after they won the WS, seems the hate is just too ingrained.
    Once again Sox fans seek help.

    Bozo the Homey August 23, 2005, 10:43 am
  • Bernie. A class act. The only thing made fun of from this poster is his hideously cloying Kenny G-grade jazz crap. But otherwise, we’ve got no beef with Bernie.
    (and once again a Yankees fan, this time it’s Bozo the Homey, reveals how closely he follows the Red Sox and their fans(!) by referring to SoSH’s pet nickname for Mo – only somebody scouring the web or visiting SoSH would know this. This wouldn’t indicate some sort of detached nonchalance about the enemy that YFs love to claim they have)

    SF August 23, 2005, 11:05 am
  • I encountered RSN jargon (heavily reliant on homophobic vernacular by the way) while living a whole year in Boston. That’s my excuse for knowing a shitload about the Nation. It was pretty much impossible not to learn the language of the enemy.
    Here’s a poll question: What’s worse? Bernie Williams’ Jazz crap or Bronson Arroyo’s K-Rock inspired sensitive Frat Rock crap?
    In a close one, my vote for worse goes to Arroyo’s turdish music. But barely.

    Nick August 23, 2005, 11:18 am
  • SF, going on the net and reading what is posted, isn’t that what brings us here. As far as I know SoSH can’t even be accessed anymore unless you are a member, which I am not. Also that is not the only place that uses that nickname, there are many other Sox bloggers out there and some even post here, as you well know. I didn’t know that as a Yankee fan I couldn’t go out and read Sox fans’ blogs, I thought that was what they blogged for so people would read it and they could express themselves. I never hated the Sox until last year, I still don’t hate most Sox players, except for Schilling. Sox fans are another story. I know not all Sox fans are haters, but damn some of you really need to get some help, so much hate just ain’t healthy.

    Bozo the Homey August 23, 2005, 11:40 am
  • Bozo – Don’t you think that your last post is kind of like the pot calling the kettle black? You stated that “I never hated the Sox until last year, I still don’t hate most Sox players, except for Schilling.” How is that different from Sox fans voicing their detest toward A-Rod?

    JennyO August 23, 2005, 12:27 pm
  • I don’t hate the Sox this year. Most of my feelings of hate, as I said, are mainly brought on by Sox fans. As to the difference between Yankees fans and Sox fans: Where is the posting about Schilling being an arrogant, egotistical, loud mouth whose glory seeking led him to put fake blood (ketchup?) on his sock last year? I don’t see a discussion thread about how everybody hates Schilling, about how his own teammates can’t stand him, about how he posts on blogs and insults other players (calling out Rodriguez earlier this year). How about a nickname for Schilling from Yankee fans, is there one? How about Boston Sucks chants at Yankee Stadium, they are very rare, Yankees Suck chants at Fenway, every single game 4-5 times a game. Sometimes you hear Yankees Suck chants and they aren’t even playing the Yankees at the time!?! How about Sox Hater hats, I haven’t ever seen one, they may exist but I haven’t seen Rodriguez wear one. I saw Schilling wear a Yankee Hater cap to suck up to RSN. I guess those are the differences between my hate for Schilling and RSN hate for AROD and the Yankees. I believe Schilling is the single biggest reason the Sox beat the Yankees last year, Big Papi second, Dave Roberts third and Keith Foulke fourth. I have respect for Schilling as a player, as a person its another question. He openly lobbied to get traded to the Yankees or the Sox. Yet when he gets to Boston he is now a Yankee Hater? What does that tell you? I see Schilling as just another hater, why couldn’t he just take pride in the incredible achievement of bringing Boston its first WS in 86 years. He could have been the king of Boston and MLB if he had shown some dignity and class. Instead he calls out Rodriguez, calls Pinella a goon (nobody else on Boston’s roster said anything), and generally shows himself to be the glory seeking, self-aggrandizing(sp.) egoist he really is everytime he opens his mouth. I know what it’s like to root for players you don’t really like as people (Sheffield), they do great things on the field, but personally you just think to yourself sometimes “If only he would just shut the F*&! Up!” Yet Yankee fans have no derogitory nicknames (that I know of) for Schilling, Ortiz, Damon, Varitek, Ramirez. We all appreciate how good these guys make Boston, we all hate that they beat the Yankees last year, we all wish they would go away (why couldn’t they just trade Ramirez?), but we don’t feel the need to insult them and ridicule every little misstep or arrogant act. I hope that explains the difference but to sum it up one last time, I hate Schilling for the same reason I hate some Sox fans, Sox fans hate Yankee players because they are Yankee players. If Varitek ever signed on with the Yankees (like Damon might next year) Sox fans would have a new derogitory nickname for him within a year.

    Bozo the Homey August 23, 2005, 2:26 pm
  • Brad,
    1) Do you always have trouble remembering things you like? I’m sure you were pleased when Schilling said A-Rod was not a real Yankee, and more, but now you only seem to remember his nice comments.
    2) A-Rod has put his a-holeness behind him. During the Series it seemed Schilling might have done the same, but he apparently reverted to his true nature in spring training. Schilling never wants to get into a Who’s The Bigger Asshole Contest.

    john yf August 23, 2005, 3:08 pm
  • See, now I am willing to go on the record and say that I hate the Yankees as a team. I really do. I hate everything about the organization, it’s stupid no-facial-hair rule idiocy, it’s dump of a stadium, it’s blowhard of a radio announcer, it’s cut-rate money-store-touting fraud of a hall-of-famer, the fact that they ruined my 10th birthday (Bucky F-ing Dent, in case anyone is wondering when it was). But I don’t have blanket hatred for their players (I like Bernie, I think Jeter is a terrific class act and would be thrilled to have him on the Sox even as I think he has flaws, and I sincerely respect Joe Torre and think he’s proven himself the cream of the crop and a pretty fantastic manager, if not perfect). I don’t even hate Sheff, though I think he’s pretty selfish sometimes. For that matter I don’t love much of what Curt Schilling says, that he supported the moron in the oval office, even though I want him to pitch lights out. And I don’t even hate Yankees fans. At least not all of them, like Bozo hates us Sox fans. (and Bozo, if you Yankees fans don’t waste any time insulting the Sox why do you spend several sentences saying how much of an a$$ Curt is? You may not call him a name, but you certainly are plenty obsessed) Hell, some of my best friends are Yankees fans (like, say, YF himself). Some of my best friends are Republicans, too (also like YF!). But that doesn’t mean I hate them. I just don’t understand how they can be so dumb. Big difference.

    SF August 23, 2005, 3:11 pm
  • These discussions have made me realize there is really ONLY ONE THING I dislike about the Red Sox. That is the white, twenty-something, drunken-asshole part of the Nation that thinks saying “the Yankees suck” is clever, and that has become such a big part of the Red Sox image. The question is why the rest of the Nation puts up with them.
    Is it sometimes annoying when Ortiz mouths off? Sure, but let’s face it, no one is accusing him of being a great intellect as well as a great hitter, and the Sox are bigger than Ortiz, no matter how big a role he played in the pennant: in a few years he’ll be retired or traded and the Sox will still be here. Is Schilling’s pandering to the hordes with his Yankee Hater camp silly? Yes. But so what? He’s not my role model, but he did pitch some great games when it counted most.
    I love New England, I love Fenway, and I appreciate the place of the Sox in Boston and New England. All this hating is a waste of time.

    john yf August 23, 2005, 3:21 pm
  • The question is why the rest of the Nation puts up with them.
    We put up with them for the same reason you guys put up with the slovenly, drunk, John Sterling-loving cretins in the bleachers at Yankee Stadium (or, in the case of one game I went to which the Sox weren’t even involved in, right behind home plate dressed up in an Armani suit). Because both of our teams, as YF wrote about way earlier in this thread, have their own fair share of morons who drink, berate, and spew idiocy. It would be wrong for Sox fans to deny these people exist in our camp, and it would be equally as foolish for Yankees fans to do the same. They don’t define you, right? You shouldn’t be so arrogant as to think they define us in our entirety.

    SF August 23, 2005, 4:01 pm
  • //John Sterling-loving cretins in the bleachers at Yankee Stadium//
    Just to clarify, we may be cretins, but we don’t like John Sterling.

    Jen August 23, 2005, 4:14 pm
  • My earlier comments were stated out of pure fun and didn’t think I was going to stike such a nerve. Many of the idiots out there (both Sox and Yanks fans) that are cheering ‘1918’ (well, last year anyway) and ‘Yankees Suck’ wouldn’t be able to tell you the names of all the players on the team they’re supposedly cheering for. They’re fair-weather fans. Every team has them!

    JennyO August 23, 2005, 4:45 pm
  • My earlier comments were stated out of pure fun and didn’t think I was going to stike such a nerve. Many of the idiots out there (both Sox and Yanks fans) that are cheering ‘1918’ (well, last year anyway) and ‘Yankees Suck’ wouldn’t be able to tell you the names of all the players on the team they’re supposedly cheering for. They’re fair-weather fans. Every team has them!

    JennyO August 23, 2005, 4:46 pm

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