Some Math, Real and Speculative

.05 x (3 x 27,000,000) = 4,050,000

.05 x (10 x 25,000,000) = 12,500,000

.05 x (8 x 23,000,000) = 9,200,000

There are countless other permutations of the math.  Somehow I don’t see how Scott Boras can end up losing on this one.   Unless he was fired, of course. 

If Boras is still Rodriguez’ agent, and Alex re-ups with the Yankees, then Boras went from a guaranteed $4M agent’s fee to a much higher guaranteed fee (over many more years, for sure). He’s locked in business, all because of shrewd contract writing several years ago.  I imagine there are a number of columnists licking their chops, pre-writing those columns  in which they have a field day with Boras as having "lost" if Rodriguez comes back for "only" a couple of hundred million.  The only legitimate way they can call Boras a "loser" is if he is either fired or Alex signs a contract for pennies more than his previous deal. 

50 comments… add one
  • Does he still get a cut if he didn’t negotiate the contract?

    yankeemonkey November 14, 2007, 4:23 pm
  • I have no idea what Boras’ contract with Rodriguez says, but I imagine that unless Rodriguez outright fires Boras and does this himself, he will get the cut he always does. And even if he is fired I imagine he will receive something — after all, he was the person who got A-Rod the opt-out clause in the first place and gave Rodriguez that much more potential earning power.

    SF November 14, 2007, 4:26 pm
  • Although Boras might not be a loser financially — and may not end up being a loser in PR terms either — I am curious how his reputation is affected, if at all, by the combination of this and the Matsuzaka negotiations, when he had everyone thinking he was going to hold Daisuke out for a $100 million contract.
    Perhaps the only thing these situations do is show that an agent is still ultimately an employee of the player, and the player still dictates when a deal gets done, and with whom.

    Paul SF November 14, 2007, 4:30 pm
  • John Sterling said on the Mike and Mad Dog show that on a scale of 1-100 of this being done, it’s 101.

    Jay-YF November 14, 2007, 4:31 pm
  • Boras’ reputation is def tarnished by this. Money or not. He has money he is about power and he just lost a whole lot.

    sam-YF November 14, 2007, 4:32 pm
  • Jay-YF:
    As per BB commenters, “It is high…it is far…Oops, my bad, he just signed with the Angels.”

    yankeemonkey November 14, 2007, 4:35 pm
  • And they said A-Rod left $60 million on the table to get the deal done.

    Jay-YF November 14, 2007, 4:38 pm
  • What will the union think, I wonder?

    Paul SF November 14, 2007, 4:40 pm
  • So this is interesting:
    Does this mean Boras gets the pink slip? Or is it more posturing?

    yankeemonkey November 14, 2007, 4:43 pm
  • Interestingly, this is the leakiest “negotiation” ever. So much of this seems PR-based: A-Rod’s statement, Hank’s newly minted statement out a few minutes ago. What happened to negotiating in private, with confidence?
    Neither side can stand to not be the center of attention, clearly.

    SF November 14, 2007, 4:46 pm
  • Lonn Trost’s statement as per M&MD:
    The two sides are talking presently. Nothing’s been resolved. No comment on whether Boras is participating.
    This is insane. Three weeks ago, who would’ve thunkit that ARod might get res-signed before Mariano?

    yankeemonkey November 14, 2007, 4:49 pm
  • So what happens if they agree to a deal without Boras “in the room,” as the Yankees put it? Does the union file a complaint and get the contract nullified?

    Paul SF November 14, 2007, 4:55 pm
  • River ave blues has a different take on this. Id agree with their interpretation….

    sam-YF November 14, 2007, 5:02 pm
  • Can the union really do that?

    Lar November 14, 2007, 5:03 pm
  • I just read that part of the CBA. Sounds like it’s that an agent cannot negotiate on behalf of a player who’s not his client. Nowhere does it say that a player cannot negotiate for himself if he so chooses.

    yankeemonkey November 14, 2007, 5:05 pm
  • Hank, (got it from waswatching):
    “Alex has reached out to us through a third party,” Steinbrenner said today. “It kind of looks like he wants to stay.”
    Steinbrenner hinted that Rodriguez might make concessions on his salary to make up for the lost Rangers subsidy.
    “It looks like he’s willing to make certain sacrifices to stay a Yankee,” Steinbrenner said.
    Reports said Yankees officials want to meet with Rodriguez without agent Scott Boras. Boras did not immediately return a call seeking comment but has generally been opposed to being left out of contract negotiations.
    “I’m not going to get into details at this point,” Steinbrenner said.

    Lar November 14, 2007, 5:09 pm
  • Poor MudHens…I’m sure the ticket sales were set to go through the roof.

    yankeemonkey November 14, 2007, 5:11 pm
  • Understatement of the century:
    “Boras … has generally been opposed to being left out of contract negotiations.”
    In other news, the Pope has generally been opposed to being left out of heaven.

    Paul SF November 14, 2007, 5:18 pm
  • hahahaha.

    Brad November 14, 2007, 5:36 pm
  • Here’s where I step in and say that I’m say that Alex has opted to return to NY, as it only makes them better. But, I’m still against giving Mike Lowell a fourth year under any circumstances, so I plead with the FO: Now that the best player is gone, please contact Florida and give them whatever they want for Miguel Cabrerra. People say he’s overweight, and that he can’t field, and that he’s a problem, but I’ve been a Sox fan long enough to remember when they all said the same thing about Manny. How has that worked out?

    Brad November 14, 2007, 5:44 pm
  • edit: say that I’m sad Alex…

    Brad November 14, 2007, 5:45 pm
  • Well, I don’t think anyone ever thought Manny was overweight. He just wears baggy uniforms. I’ve seen him working out at Sports Club LA here in Boston, the dude is JACKED with almost not body fat to speak of.
    Not that I was checking him out or anything.

    LocklandSF November 14, 2007, 5:58 pm
  • There’s something to be said for the theory that Cabrera would learn from guys like Ortiz and Ramirez the value of hard work and self-discipline to continue hitting hard. Who’s there to mentor him in Florida right now? Dontrelle DWI Willis?

    Paul SF November 14, 2007, 6:10 pm
  • This is intense:
    Buster Onley has a great recap that, coming from Buster, I tend to trust: Its on the ESPN frontpage now: Never Say Never: A-Rod, Yankees talk deal.
    The key bit to this new item is the fact that the A-Rod is doing this without his agent. It has been expressed in both camps that this is something that can happen, but only if Scott Boras is not involved. The Yankees are resentful of Boras using them as leverage and A-Rod is pissed over the way Boras has allowed this thing to make A-Rod look like an asshole.
    What does this news mean?
    Well, it could mean a couple of things:
    A-Rod/Boras changed their minds when they realized that the market could not support $300 million over 10 years. This is the most cynical viewpoint. A-Rod and Boras hatched a plan, saw it fail spectacularly and now are crawling back the only way they can. The Yankees have made it clear before that they’d be happy to talk to A-Rod, without Boras. They refuse to get into the Boras-fueled A-Rod Sweepstakes. But one-on-one, on a deal that accounts for the loss of the $20 million subsidy via the Rangers? That is something that fits for the Yankees, and assuages their pride somewhat.
    This obviously paints A-Rod as going for the money entirely, even to the point of crawling back into a place he left horribly. It implies he lacks any kind of thought process and just wants money, money, and more money, even if its somewhere he hates.
    If the market was less than the Yankees’ previous offer, and A-Rod still chose the Angels or whatnot, then I’d say that A-Rod was not a money-hungry bitch. He left money on the table because he just didn’t want to play for the Yankees. That makes him a wimp and a coward in some ways, but at least he was doing what he wants and what he felt was best. But if this is completely money-driven, then all those money-hungry bitch thoughts come back.
    How can A-Rod avoid this? By firing Boras, making it clear that Boras was never working in his self-interest, A-Rod can show that it wasn’t that he was wrong, but that Boras was screwing up by announcing the opt-out so callously and then refusing to work towards what Rodriguez really wants: the Yankees. This storyline portrays Boras’ as money-hungry and diabolical and A-Rod as carried for the ride until he worked up the nerve to say: screw this, this is where I want to be.
    Will I buy that? Not really, but it will go towards defusing the idea that this is all Boras’ plan concocted because he realized he misread the market. The other way to avoid this is for A-Rod to accept an obvious pay-cut. To make it clear that Yankees are his choice, and not a choice that leads to more money, which was obviously Boras’ choice. This will be the true proof that he’s not a money-hungry bitch. He’ll still be a man full of unneccessary drama and sensitivity, and maybe a bit weak to let your agent decide your livelihood to this extent, but it won’t be the first time an agent screwed a player (Paging Bonzi Wells.)
    Which brings me to the larger point. The Yankees, like any other team, wants players that are not only talented and marketable, but also want to be there. The fans definitely care about this fact. If you are just signing up for the paycheck, slug through the year with an air of indifference and are always keeping your eye on the next paycheck, its hard to stir up investment. If A-Rod somehow makes me believe that he really wants to play with the Yankees, that he wants to keep fighting the good fight of learning/trying to be clutch, succeeding in the playoffs and becoming a part of this organization fully, then I see myself easily pulling for him. If he wants back on the Yankees’ teat because he realize that no other teat tastes as sweet, well screw you and I hope you enjoy it when we flap dollar bills at you when you come up to bat.

    Carlos November 14, 2007, 6:20 pm
  • It’s all but official: go check PA.
    It’s about time he showed some spine.

    doug YF November 14, 2007, 7:40 pm
  • this whole thing is embarrassing for everyone involved (except bill hicks). boras looks like a tool, a-rod is a tool, and the yankees got tooled. how can any self respecting teammate or yankee fan accept him back? it doesn’t seem that long ago that a-rod was batting 8th in october, now he’s robbing the dignity of the most respected franchise in baseball.
    good luck to you mr. girardi. at least in florida, the owner was the only one who didn’t respect you. now, it’s the main cog in your very expensive wheel that doesn’t respect you.
    let the lil’ stein era begin. where words and ethics mean nothing as long as a-rod takes a couple of bucks off the top. having a spine is overrated anyways.

    sf rod November 14, 2007, 8:13 pm
  • I thought agents get 2%? Where’s this 5% figure coming from? Is Boras different?
    But with how bad things look, Boras somehow did his job. He takes all the heat for the opt-out and A-Rod somehow comes out looking LESS greedy. I think A-Rod ended up doing better, or no worse, monetarily than he would have had he never opted out AND he looks like he salvaged his dignity from his evil agent. Considering how else it could have gone down, after the opt out fiasco, that’s pretty amazing.

    NH Rob November 14, 2007, 8:39 pm
  • Rod- Those are some nice accusations to throw around with nothing to back them up. Suddenly A-Rod doesnt respect Girardi, a man he never played for or with? That makes no sense at all.
    How exactly is it that the yankees “ethics” compromised? By accepting back someone who admitted they had done wrong?
    I have plenty of respect for myself and my yankee fandom and Ill accept A-Rod back because he is the best player in baseball. No different than most SFs would have accepted him had he signed with the sox. I guess the yankees should be blamed for making the best possible move to make their team better. Go peddle your hate elsewhere.

    sam-YF November 14, 2007, 9:30 pm
  • lol @ sf rod’s contrived, impotent outrage.

    doug YF November 14, 2007, 10:49 pm
  • Agents normally get 5%, but I’ve also read somewhere that Boras is cheaper, even, so who knows.
    I think if ARod takes less money, it would be enough. We’ll see though.

    Lar November 14, 2007, 11:06 pm
  • I’m still trying to figure out how the late Bill Hicks (Denis Leary before Denis Leary stole his act) is involved.

    Nick-YF November 14, 2007, 11:11 pm
  • I wrote this on another thread, but if what is being rumored is true then it fits here.
    “Fortunately for Red Sox fans the Sox front office wasn’t able to get A-Tool because the Players Union said he can’t take less than the contract stipulates, even if A-tool agreed to it. Eventually Texas got the Yankees to pony up but only because the Rangers were still paying some too.
    In effect what happened was the Rangers went temporarily insane, realized their mistake and tried to rid themselves of it.
    Neither the Red Sox nor the Yankees wanted to pay A-Tool what the Rangers signed him for because that figure was insane!
    So even though it is a few years later, and salaries did take a downturn for a few years after A-Tool and Manny signed their big contracts… salaries HAVE risen of late so that makes the, what is it, 27 Million that A-Tool would get next year, …lemee think oh yeah…
    still INSANE!
    In my estimation then, talk of 35 million over the life of the deal, or 38 million or 44 million per. Well, that’s insanity too… just at a much higher level!…”
    And… if in the end A-Tool doesn’t go anywhere but back to the Yankees, (who tend to overpay anyway) then I think it’s safe to say that everyone else thought A-Tool’s original contract was still insane too! …And the Yankees said that’s as insane as we’ll get!

    Brian November 15, 2007, 12:59 am
  • sam- my girardi accusations are based on the timing of a-rods comments as to possible free agent fallout due to torres departure. he said these things the day after opting out, which also happens to be the day the yankees leaked that girardi would soon be announced as the new manager. as for compromised ethics, it’ll be the yankees ill spun justification that boras was a bad man and that dealing with a-rod one on one made the difference, that crosses this line. boras is a-rods hired representative and close friend, not his kidnapper. how am i supposed to peddle a-rod hate when yf’s (you excluded sam) were handing it out for free all over these boards the last two weeks?
    nick- bill is tom’s son, heir to his fortune, and VP of hicks holdings LLC. that 21.3 million means more to him than it ever will to daddy.

    sf rod November 15, 2007, 6:21 am
  • Rod
    I have no idea what you are talking about but I can promise you that A-Rod and Girardi will get along just fine. Of all A-Rod’s drawbacks I dont think he has ever showed up his manager. As for the other players, the may not love his dog and pony show but the will love his 150 RBI and 45 HRs per year.
    Your comment about the ethics is laughable. This is isnt a hospital. I fail to see how this is even an ethical issue.
    Finally, the yankees made a business decision. They did what was best for their team. How anybody can blame them is beyond me. The yankees just became an even better team next season and way beyond. This is why fans are and should be happy.

    sam-YF November 15, 2007, 8:37 am
  • The more one reads about this situation the more it sounds like another heavily orchestrated affair. Hank Steinbrenner’s statements feel like canned efforts to smooth A-Rod’s return, A-Rod reached out through “mutual friends at Goldman Sachs” (right…), and Tyler Kepner says the contract may be worth 10/270, which represents just about no concession on the part of A-Rod, unless you actually believed that Boras was going to get $350M for him with little market.
    The public spectacle of this whole thing has been frankly kind of off-putting – at least with Schilling’s deal the public disclosures (which I am not a fan of) were written by Curt and in his own voice, not in that of a PR firm (a la Rodriguez). This all just reinforces my own opinion, admittedly biased, that the parties involved, from the Yankee organization back to A-Rod (and Boras too), are narcissists concerned with occupying the spotlight at the expense of common decorum and decency.
    Why can’t they handle this one like they handled Posada (and Mo, so far)? What is preventing this soap opera from having any sense of normalcy?

    SF November 15, 2007, 8:40 am
  • The more I read about it the more I feel that it was a change in heart and a realization of error from A-Rod and Boras.
    I dont really see how the yankees organization can be called to blame here. Any news concerning A-Rod is gonna occupy the spotlight and result in tons of articles. Look at how many were as a result of Torre’s one line statement of “maybe Alex will come to LA?” The team made a decision to renegotiate based on what was best for their team both on the field and their business. I dont think they were trying to dominate the spotlight etc. In fact they were actually able to keep the first few days of talks under wraps. Should they not have signed him so they could avoid taking attention from all of the other important things that were going on in baseball in the middle of november? How would you see it going down better? Do you think there wouldnt be as much press coverage if he signed with another team like the Red Sox or the Mets? I highly doubt it.
    I realize you admitted your bias but the hoopla concerning Matsuzaka was no different last year. I didnt see you hammering away on the sox front office then for doing essentially the same.

    sam-YF November 15, 2007, 8:55 am
  • Sam: I didn’t really enjoy the Matsuzaka follies. Here’s a comment I made during the shenanigans. Though it wasn’t as harsh as what I said above, I think at least I had the same sensation that everything was noise for the press, and not much else. Also, with that negotiation there was about three weeks of silence and then a circus. This one has been a circus from Day 1!

    SF November 15, 2007, 9:14 am
  • Wait, I take that back, I did kind of enjoy the Matsuzaka follies, at least from the perspective of blogging on this site.

    SF November 15, 2007, 9:15 am
  • Don’t forget the Theo-Luchinno spat that played itself in the press. The Sox, like the Yanks are accountable to a rather rabid fanbase, which probably explains why a lot of their internal matters are aired out publicly. Or they’re just as “narcissistic” as the Yanks.

    Nick-YF November 15, 2007, 9:21 am
  • Basically there is nothing else to talk about in the baseball world. A-Rod is the games’ best player and Boras one of its most derisive figures. This one wasnt gonna stay under wraps for long…

    sam-YF November 15, 2007, 9:22 am
  • The Theo/Lucchino spat was awful, Nick, completely undignified and narcissistic. Especially to a Soxfan.
    No double standards here.

    SF November 15, 2007, 9:30 am
  • Why do I not believe that Boras has really been shut out of negotiations? Is 10 years at $27m per really so much less than 10 years at $35 mil per that was Boras’ desire?

    Paul SF November 15, 2007, 9:34 am
  • Yeah, I find all these things unsavory to a degree, but you have to contextualize them as well. This is the New York/Boston press, which, for better or worse, plays a big part in developing the perception of both teams’ fanbases. I think using the media in situations like this is inevitable. The truth is that it probably is working for the Yanks front office. The Daily News is praising Hank’s tough no-nonsense stance. Think about how he was portrayed during the Torre affair.

    Nick-YF November 15, 2007, 9:35 am
  • And just last week I speculated that the Sox were doing Lowell damage control through the press, Nick.
    I am not a fan of this type of stuff.

    SF November 15, 2007, 9:36 am
  • I’ve read that Boras is still involved, and that the Yanks never told A-Rod that he couldn’t be involved.

    Nick-YF November 15, 2007, 9:37 am
  • “Why do I not believe that Boras has really been shut out of negotiations? Is 10 years at $27m per really so much less than 10 years at $35 mil per that was Boras’ desire?”
    YES. Thats alot less $70 million less. Thats nothing to sneeze at. Thats Mike Lowell! I think that its possible they could have got him for a bit less but any premium is worth it to end this entire episode now Also, as far as the economics go, it sounds like this could be less than Alex would have got TOTAL for two 5-year contracts.
    Boras is involved in the negotiation. He has to be allowed to do so as per the CBA. The yankees demanded a meeting without Boras in the room prior to the opening of negotiations. This was a meeting the asked for prior to the opt-out that Boras wouldnt let happen.

    sam-YF November 15, 2007, 9:47 am
  • It’s not surprising but that’s some serious baiting in calling the organization “narcissistic” even while acknowledging the same comes from the Sox side.
    A-Rod is the biggest story of the off-season. He was in 2000. 2003 too. And those stretched on for months with ridiculous twists and turns, especially 2003-04! If all goes well this stuff can be finished in about three weeks after the Series (which the Sox won, by the way – first Beckett, now this – be happy people!). That’s impressive especially for A-Rod and the Yankees.
    In the time that most teams have yet to make one post-season move, the Yankees will have:
    -“fired” their manager of 12 years and 4 rings
    – interviewed three managerial candidates
    – “fired” an organization icon
    – hired their new manager
    – signed their free agent catcher
    – signed their “free agent” 3B
    – signed their free agent closer
    I don’t see narcissism there. I see a business taking take care of its business. There are few stories without substance coming out of that camp.

    NH Rob November 15, 2007, 9:47 am
  • Nick – I also read that it’s part of the CBA, so I think they can’t officially say that..

    Lar November 15, 2007, 12:19 pm
  • sam- you may find my comment about ethics laughable, but i would ask you to explain to me how the ethics of the yankees as a business is not compromised when the Chairman of the Board makes these statements…….
    “the team will not renegotiate with Alex Rodriguez if the third baseman exercises the opt-out clause in his contract,”
    “It’s clear he didn’t want to be a Yankee, and I don’t want anybody on my team that doesn’t want to be a Yankee.”
    “We’re not going to back down, It’s goodbye.”

    if the head of the company lying doesn’t compromise the ethics of his business in your mind, then i’ll laugh right along with you.
    as for not understanding a perceived rift between a-rod and girardi, i can see where you wouldn’t want to connect the pieces. but i’m certain joe has. the morning of Oct. 29th the yankees leaked that girardi would be named manager later in the week. that afternoon boras tells the Daily News….
    “Rodriguez’s expressed concern for the state of flux within the Yankees organization, from the unsettled managerial situation to the status of pending free agents Mariano Rivera, Jorge Posada and Andy Pettitte.”

    sf rod November 15, 2007, 9:08 pm
  • sf rod:
    There is nothing in that statement about Girardi, it clearly alluded to the fact that the Yankees didn’t have a manager to speak of. I don’t see the connection.
    As for the statements by Steinbrenner as being unethical, I don’t agree either. They were bluster emitted by someone who appears to be, at least to me and a couple of the YFs who write at this site, a horse’s pitooty (sp?). That doesn’t make him a crook or unethical, though. It does hurt his credibility, in a way, and that may be an issue down the road in dealing with other clubs or agents, it will likely end up costing him money, but not much else.

    SF November 15, 2007, 9:14 pm

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