The Searing Hot Stove

Rotoworld reports a Sox source touting a "legitimate offer" for Manny Ramirez, one that revolves around "young pitching".  No teams are specifically sourced for this offer, though Rotoworld speculates.  Color us a bit skeptical.  We grant the Red Sox the same leeway to concoct "legitimate offers" that agents like Scott Boras present when leveraging teams against each other.  This SF has no doubts that the Sox would leak the availability of a "legitimate offer", real or not, to get other teams off their duffs, if that’s even possible.

The last time the Sox had a deal for Manny it was for, at the very least, fair value: Alex Rodriguez.  We have our barometer, though it is two years later.  Should be an interesting couple of days.

21 comments… add one
  • Call me crazy, but I bet dollars to donuts that it happens this week.

    Brad December 5, 2006, 10:04 am
  • Cordero would solve your closer issue.

    bloodyank78 December 5, 2006, 10:24 am
  • Seems the Red Sox are trying to create a market that does not exist.

    Seth December 5, 2006, 10:30 am
  • create a market that does not exist..
    For a front-line hitter nearly guaranteed to drive in 120, score a hundred himself, hit 30HR’s, and bat .310? The Cubs and the Astros sure thought there was a market for such a person. Maybe I’m misunderstanding what you’re saying?

    Brad December 5, 2006, 10:37 am
  • A market exists, but does a market exist for what the Red Sox are wanting?
    And the Padres are reportedly close to a deal with Maddux? Could this make Peavy expendable?
    I’m in a City Council meeting all day today, and something tells me the Red Sox will be a different team when I return…

    Paul SF December 5, 2006, 10:45 am
  • I am sure there is a market, but these types of statements have to be taken with some skepticism. Publicly acknowledging a “fair” offer sends a couple of signals. First, it tells teams that are sitting on the fence that they are on notice, time might be running out. Also, it sends a message to a possible partner that they aren’t a done deal yet, and that the Sox are still listening, though it does alert the trading partner to hold on, they are in the running. And that’s if that “fair” offer is even one that exists. The Sox could be blowing proverbial smoke here, though I imagine they have fielded some inquiries — as Brad says, there’s a market for a guy like Manny.

    SF December 5, 2006, 10:45 am
  • The Red Sox told one club on Monday that they have received a legitimate offer for Ramirez, and that it revolves around “young pitching.”
    How is this any different then
    “Perhaps, as Bonds’ agent, Jeff Borris, suggests, other teams are involved in the bidding.”
    The red sox have a lot to gain by leaking that teams are offering up their young studs
    I think there is a market for manram. But the quote seems to imply the sox are trying to shift the frame of what the market is.
    How are there no Mets rumors for this? They seem like the perfect team to get him.

    Seth December 5, 2006, 10:46 am
  • For Lastings? No thanks.
    Trade one issue for another with a smaller bat? From everything I’ve heard on the FAN and other places, this kid is a head case with more cockiness than talent.

    Brad December 5, 2006, 10:50 am
  • My point exactly, Seth. The leak of this “fair offer” seems to me to be an attempt to catalyze the market. I am skeptical of how “fair” a supposed offer is. If it was leaked to the press that it exists, I question it’s existence. And if it does exist, I question it’s fairness. But that’s not to say offers don’t exist at all. With Manny, someone’s gotta be making the effort.

    SF December 5, 2006, 10:52 am
  • I was thinking Pelfry makes sense for both sides.

    Seth December 5, 2006, 11:00 am
  • Remember August and September of last year, when a Sox pitcher couldn’t expect to win even if he held the opposition to three runs or less? I (anecdotally) remember a bunch of games like that.
    Trade Manny for young pitching, and get ready for a lot more such losses. Obviously, good pitching wins games, but not without run support.
    Manny may be an odd duck and even a malcontent in Boston, but the fact is he has produced for the Sox whether happy or not in a way that is not replaceable — at least not without great risk. His consistency makes his numbers doubly valuable.
    So I continue to believe that breaking up the steadiest and most dangerous 3-4 combination in baseball would go down as among the very worst moves in Sox management history, ranking right up there with letting Fisk and Clemens walk. (I’m avoiding using the B-word.)

    Hudson December 5, 2006, 12:29 pm
  • …that would be historic hudson: trading “b—” twice…
    …doesn’t appear that the sox are all that interested in doing it anyway…see tony m’s article in today’s herald…

    dc December 5, 2006, 1:03 pm
  • didnt see anything here so Here it is. Jon Lester’s cancer has reportedly gone into remission and sources say he expects to be in Spring Training.
    http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/news/story?id=2686799

    TJ December 5, 2006, 1:04 pm
  • TJ – I did post the boston.com version in the ‘Back to Baseball’ thread but it got lost in the firefight there. It’s very important and encouraging news to Red Sox fans. Also, it shows how far cancer treatment has progressed over the last several decades, that he might be ready to come back as soon as the treatment’s done.
    Here’s the boston.com article again, by the way.

    Scott SF December 5, 2006, 1:40 pm
  • I’m sure this “legitimate offer” is about as legitimate as the fact that the Red Sox and Padres have never discussed Jake Peavy — heaven’t even brought him up, mind you.
    More and more reports seem to be focusing on the Sox and Mariners. I’m not a Sexson fan though…

    Paul SF December 5, 2006, 2:47 pm
  • Sexson: BLECCH.

    SF December 5, 2006, 2:55 pm
  • Will Carroll says Boston rejected Broxton and LaRoche for Manny. Not sure how thrilled I am here…LaRoche probably could have played SS right away, so no need to give Lugo big money, and Broxton fills the hole in our pen.

    desturbd1 December 5, 2006, 2:56 pm
  • I think SF makes a good point: Manny for A-Rod was pretty much equal value. What’s the pitching equivalent of A-Rod? Peavy? Felix Hernandez? A bunch of relievers and a closer? Time will tell, I guess…

    Sam December 5, 2006, 2:59 pm
  • I imagine there’s one more piece to that puzzle, d1, if Carroll is right. The Sox may be looking for one more player that they can spin off (with a farmhand?) for proven talent. Do you see the Sox going into opening day with Pedroia, LaRoche, WMP, Broxton, DM (if signed), Okajima, all holding important roles? That sounds like an interesting scenario, but not exactly the most stable one.
    If Theo can prize one additional prospect of a high level, he can probably afford to then keep 2 of the 3 he acquires, grab an existing Sox farmhand, and transform those guys into an experienced player.

    SF December 5, 2006, 3:00 pm
  • “The Sox may be looking for one more player that they can spin off (with a farmhand?) for proven talent. Do you see the Sox going into opening day with Pedroia, LaRoche, WMP, Broxton, DM (if signed), Okajima, all holding important roles? That sounds like an interesting scenario, but not exactly the most stable one.”
    Yeah, that’s what I figured…but I’m not sure it’s really fair of Theo to ask much more then LaRoche and Broxton. I would say Broxton looks to be, taking his age, service time and performance into account, the Dodgers’ most valuable commodity. I could understand wanting another B-prospect…but one of the Loney/LaRoche crowd seems to be asking for a bit much. Though maybe a guy like Kuo could be an option…
    This also brings me back to my desire to see Boston sign one of the veteran 2B’s still available to a 1-year deal. Pedroia and LaRoche would be left to fight it out for SS, and if the 2B vet underperforms, the two of them could take over the infield.

    desturbd1 December 5, 2006, 3:06 pm
  • I would have liked one mmore player out of that. Is Manny worth more than a prospect and a second-year player, albeit a pitcher with really good rookie stats? I think so, even if it’s a B-level prospect, as you said, d-1.

    Paul SF December 5, 2006, 3:09 pm

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